QQ against another big stack

[willie]

party 50+5, i doubled up early, and then this hand happens

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t15 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

SB (t1160)
BB (t915)
UTG (t75)
UTG+1 (t1875)
MP1 (t2090)
Hero (t2030)
CO (t975)
Button (t880)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with Q/images/graemlins/club.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls t15, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 raises to t125</font>, Hero calls t125, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, UTG+1 folds.

Flop: (t290) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif, 7/images/graemlins/club.gif, J/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">MP1 bets t500</font>, Hero ???


His raise preflop is indicative of a big hand, i also have a big hand.

He overbets the pot here, and has me relatively shook in my boots about my queens. What would people do here against another big stack?

[citanul]

if you're this willing to be scared post flop, reraise preflop. then maybe you can fold to a push if you want.

i don't advocate that though.

citanul

[Seadood228]

Beat me to it..

Personally, I don't think you should coldcall if you plan on laying this one down to a jack high flop, unless you are playing this for set value. That might be weak, but it is the safe route, and you are tangling with another big stack. Not sure I'd play it that way though.

I don't think that reraising to say, 450ish is a bad move here. The big stack's large raise indicates weakness (not always the case though), and the one player he wouldn't want to tangle with is you. I think this alone should stop hime from playing back at you with a marginal hand.

As it plays out, nothing about the villian's betting pattern makes indicates KK, AA, or JJ IMO.

but it's not fun messing with another bigstack early in a SNG.

[lorinda]

After thinking about this for quite a while, I still can't see further than AK /images/graemlins/club.gif for your opponent.

No other hand makes any sense.

The problem now is that although we know it's a flip, we can't move him off the hand.

Someone help, I don't like this hand.

Lori

[Seadood228]

How about a junk hand?

Perhaps I'm just underestimating him, but his bets seem too big to be something meaningful..

seadood228/gambooln

[willie]

[ QUOTE ]
if you're this willing to be scared post flop,

citanul

[/ QUOTE ]

you really think this is being scared? i just think it's being kind of contemplative.

we are the only 2 big stacks at the table at the time

the blinds are really low. I might be ahead here, I've dead even w/ AKcc, drawin slim to jj, kk/aa have me crushed..

is a fold here THAT weaktight?

[lorinda]

If you didn't have the Q /images/graemlins/club.gif in your hand, would you be more inclined to play.

I would really prefer that I didn't have it here so that my opponent actually has a range of hands other than generic junk that I can beat.

Lori

[citanul]

sigh, i'm not saying that folding post flop is 100% wrong, in fact, i made no mention of post flop play at all in my post in specifics.

what i'm saying is that you made this hand infinitely harder on yourself by not reraising preflop. if you're fine playing the hand for set value, that's fine, but the information you've gotten from your opponent so far doesn't scream out "you're crushed" to me.

as another poster mentioned, 400 or so would have been a really nice sized raise. maybe even a little less.

citanul

[Seadood228]

[ QUOTE ]
in fact, i made no mention of post flop play at all in my post in specifics.

[/ QUOTE ]

I avoided this in the previous posts, on purpose /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Being completely truthful with myself, I'd fold to that bet. I think you are ahead, and I think you are the favorite, but that bet is just too big for my liking.

It's one of those hands where I've just got to give him credit for having a lot of balls.. or a better hand..

But I still prefer reraising preflop.

[willie]

I folded.

I felt that there was no reason to jam at this pot, there was some in there. My read was that i was in bad shape, given the size of his preflop bet and his overbet of the flop. I didn't NEED the pot since i was plenty healthy. I asked him if he would show, and i got the old

Sorry John, i don't remember (or whatever it is)

my response

OOOOO WATCH OUT FOR THIS GUY! he's quotin rounders!









I busted him 3 hands when he overplayed kj against my ak. I PLAY GOOT! /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[curtains]

Tough hand....

[ilya]

I like calling preflop and playing for set value and very weak-tightly otherwise. You raise to 400 preflop, he's only gotta push back a bit over a quarter of the time for you to lose chips, unless you're willing to get all-in or call a re-raise preflop. Why would you want to do that against the other big stack? On the other hand if he's a crazy sort he might come over the top with the other QQ or JJ or AK and you'd lay down and that would be sad. If he gets tricky and flat calls with AA-KK or flat calls with something like JJ and the flop gives you a weaker overpair or makes him a set, you're now more likely to lose your whole stack since the pot has gotten so big. Folding on the flop and losing 400 and the chip lead isn't fun either.

[KramerTM]

Stupid question. I am trying to use the Hand Converter you linked to, but am unable to get good results. Specifically, I am getting output without any of the actions at any point in the hand. Here is what it looks like:

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

saw flop|<font color="#C00000">saw showdown</font>

<font color="#C00000">UTG+1 (t580)</font>
<font color="#C00000">MP1 (t1620)</font>
<font color="#C00000">MP2 (t185)</font>
<font color="#C00000">MP3 (t800)</font>
<font color="#C00000">CO (t365)</font>
<font color="#C00000">Button (t525)</font>
<font color="#C00000">SB (t975)</font>
<font color="#C00000">Hero (t1580)</font>
<font color="#C00000">UTG (t1370)</font>

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.

Flop: (t150) A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(9 players)</font>

Turn: (t150) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(9 players)</font>

River: (t150) 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(9 players)</font>

Final Pot: t150

That's not even the right outcome! It also seems to indicate that all 9 players checked down to the river. Any help is greatly appreciated!

[willie]

TOP FOR THE AFTERNOON CROWD.

i kind of think this is a tough hand that could be pretty useful to other people.

[Seadood228]

I like this answer, and given what we found out about the villian, perhaps the reraise wouldn't have worked...

[callmedonnie]

I had a similar hand a few weeks ago. From your position you don't want limpers (neither did I). But I called. It was a mistake, a raggy flop saw a set and the original raiser had KK. This other stack could have it to, but if you reraise preflop you will find out quicker. You may lose some chips, but you've got plenty and more importantly the decision is easier, much.