Greenstein on Hellmuth...im confused?!?

[btk202jazz]

I have read Hellmuth's book and watched him play and from what it looks like to me he is a relatively tight player. He talks a lot about patience and how to play the big hands when you get them. He talks about playing small cards as well, but from what I have taken it he seems to be a tight player. I went to barry greenstein's website and he had written this on hellmuth. I was a tad bit confused, any input?

"Phil may go down as the pioneer in a method of playing a lot of hands and making small bets and raises that keep opponents in the pot, the theory being that he will make better decisions than they do on subsequent streets. This strategy guarantees large fluctuations and has a lot to say for it against weak opposition. This method would not work as well in a cash game where there is no rush to build up a chip stack and by virtue of playing too many pots opponents can easily take the betting lead away. In a tournament, the extra fear of going busted can keep your opponents at bay and the bad players are confused by what looks like mass hysteria to them. When Phil has his banter and his A-game working, he not only can control the table, but he can mesmerize the entire room.

Players who have been successful adopting a similar style are Gus Hansen, Layne Flack, Antonio Esfandiari, Alan Goehring, and to a small degree Daniel Negreanu."
-Greenstein

[Toy4x4]

From what I've seen Phil likes to open up when he is at a table with weaker players and the blinds are starting to be meaningful. He briefly mentions this in his book, but doesn't go into detail.

[augie00]

The reason you're confused by this is because all you've seen of Hellmuth is what you've seen on TV. You actually have no idea how Phil Hellmuth plays poker.

[btk202jazz]

I agree fully. Hopefully with this heads up tournament I can get a better understanding of how is game really is. I would like to see his mastering of this strategy. I have an idea of how Hansen uses it and exploits people based on what I have seen. Nothing like some good power poker by the best of the best.

[Hold'me]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree fully. Hopefully with this heads up tournament I can get a better understanding of how is game really is. I would like to see his mastering of this strategy. I have an idea of how Hansen uses it and exploits people based on what I have seen. Nothing like some good power poker by the best of the best.

[/ QUOTE ]
You probably won't get to see Phil's mastering. If I know NBC, and I don't, they'll do a half-assed job and just single out the big hands. They try too hard to appeal to the casual poker fan, the average joe who would never drop a dime to play but just enjoys watching others go at it.

For example, from the hands you see Gus playing on T.V. you'd imagine he plays every pot and raises with junk a majority of the time. That's certainly not the case. He might fold ten straight hands and then if he sense some weakness, he'll come over the top with his 8-4's or what have you. That's why I, along with the majority of 2+2 posters, implore NBC to release DVD's with extended coverage. Okay, these have been my two cents. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Voltron87]

Hellmuth is a tight player in that he wants to play small pots. He never like to play pots for all his stack. That is why we hear about him laying down QQ multiple times in a tourney pf, because it is a decision for his whole stack. Hellmuth is tight in that he avoids risks by avoiding big pots.

[Daliman]

Hellmuth is probably tighter than most entering pots that have already been raised, but is a lot looser than most opening pots from all i have seen/heard. He is very adept at flop-on play also, and chopping away at players.

[Army Eye]

[ QUOTE ]
I have read Hellmuth's book and watched him play and from what it looks like to me he is a relatively tight player. He talks a lot about patience and how to play the big hands when you get them.

[/ QUOTE ]

He's definitely not a tight player in tournaments. Are you sure you're not referring to his cash game advice? (also his book is more of a primer for beginners and not his personal playbook)

[legend42]

Phil's game has tightened up over the past few years, but he made his name by being loose and super aggressive- just running over tables at tournaments- raising 12 pots in a row, not giving up his blind for 20 straight orbits, stuff like that. Which is one reason he was such a poor cash game player.

But that style has largely run its course for him, as players have eventually adapted to it- and copied it. Now, he's perhaps overreacted towards the other extreme, becoming ultra-cautious.

[burningyen]

I don't think seeing how PH plays heads-up is going to tell you much about how he plays at a full table.

[cold_cash]

When is this going to be broadcast?

Or did I miss it already?

[trying2learn]

may...and don't miss it...i was lucky enough to see it live, and it's some of the best poker i've ever seen. at least in the way some of the hands played out.

[InfernoLL]

voice of reason