Im drawing to 2 outs here with KK right? [Archive]

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Angrymoog

03-09-2005, 05:03 PM

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, 2 folds, MP2 calls, 1 fold, CO calls, 2 folds, Hero raises, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls, CO calls.

Flop: (8.50 SB) 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif (4 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, MP2 raises, CO calls, Hero folds, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (7.75 BB) 5/images/graemlins/heart.gif (3 players)
UTG+1 checks, MP2 bets, CO calls, UTG+1 calls.

River: (10.75 BB) J/images/graemlins/heart.gif (3 players)
UTG+1 bets, MP2 calls, CO folds.

Final Pot: 12.75 BB

lmbree

03-09-2005, 05:09 PM

I would not fold here. What do you think UTG has? AXs? he limped, he could be raising his J10 78s, etc. I 3 bet that flop, lead the turn. If I get raised again, I can fold, if he just calls, I start assuming he has A rag. and think about check / folding.

einbert

03-09-2005, 05:10 PM

Most likely. Good fold IMO.

lmbree

03-09-2005, 05:13 PM

i just saw how many people were in this hand... if you can clear a few out with my advice, I think it is what i would do. If you think they will all be coming along you can fold preflop, but damn, I don't know if I can. I need to work on this major Leak of mine... Maybe you shouldn't add my leak to your game. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Angrymoog

03-09-2005, 05:16 PM

It got unleaked real quick for me, but ive had really aweful luck in the high pp area , im almost looking for an excust to fold /images/graemlins/wink.gif

Redeye

03-09-2005, 05:20 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If you think they will all be coming along you can fold preflop, but damn, I don't know if I can

[/ QUOTE ]

I really hope you not serious about this.

Fat Nicky

03-09-2005, 05:21 PM

Easy Easy fold for me..

Fat Nicky

03-09-2005, 05:22 PM

3-betting the flop is crazy chip spewing, with a bet/call/raise/coldcall on the flop, you don't think one of those players has a A?

JoshuaD

03-09-2005, 05:23 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If you think they will all be coming along you can fold preflop, but damn, I don't know if I can.

[/ QUOTE ]

No.

Fat Nicky

03-09-2005, 05:23 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If you think they will all be coming along you can fold preflop, but damn, I don't know if I can

[/ QUOTE ]

I really hope you not serious about this.

[/ QUOTE ]

i am just assuming this is some sort of typo, no?

JoshuaD

03-09-2005, 05:23 PM

I think you're good to fold here. If it was HU I'd want to hang around, but w/ that other guy in there you're just behind too often.

meep_42

03-09-2005, 05:26 PM

Getting a likely 15-1, I may be peeling one off here, I think I can make up the 7 SB with a c/r on the turn if I spike a K, but it's pretty marginal either way. I'd just hate to have MP raising his JT and watching everyone check the turn through.

-d

JoshuaD

03-09-2005, 05:28 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Getting a likely 15-1, I may be peeling one off here, I think I can make up the 7 SB with a c/r on the turn if I spike a K, but it's pretty marginal either way. I'd just hate to have MP raising his JT and watching everyone check the turn through.

-d

[/ QUOTE ]

That's true. But you've got UTG+1 still acting behind you, and he could be on a hand he'll 3-bet for value here. I'd hate to have to call here and fold to another 2, or even call another one.

Unless UTG+1 is aggressive, peeling one off may be better.

ErrantNight

03-09-2005, 05:30 PM

almost certainly, but you should peel one off.

Redeye

03-09-2005, 05:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If you think they will all be coming along you can fold preflop, but damn, I don't know if I can

[/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ]
I really hope you not serious about this.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
i am just assuming this is some sort of typo, no?

[/ QUOTE ]

I hope so, because it made me a little sick reading it. I took it to mean that if we thought everyone would call the raise we'd fold KK preflop... ick

meep_42

03-09-2005, 06:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I hope so, because it made me a little sick reading it. I took it to mean that if we thought everyone would call the raise we'd fold KK preflop... ick

[/ QUOTE ]

Seriously... it's ACES that never win, not Kings.

-d

psyduck

03-10-2005, 01:10 AM

you must call the flop for one more bet. remember that it is heavily stacked against you that some moron has AX, but for one more SB, you must call flop and reevaluate your action on the turn based on the turn card and the action you see. a fold on the turn for dbl-sized bets is fine, but a fold on the flop for one SB is not okay. you must make a crying call on the flop to reevaluate on the turn.

27offsooot

03-10-2005, 01:14 AM

I thought it was an easy fold at first, but I guess you can make up the bets that you need to justify calling for your 2 outer. It's marginal though.

SteveGriff

03-10-2005, 07:41 AM

Yes, I think this is a good fold, because as you say, you most probably only have two outs.

How do I come to this assessment?

1) Ok, MP2 raises you. He may have an ace, but like everyone else notes, he might be on a draw. BUT, I think the decision on whether to call or fold is decided more on who else calls his raise.

You can't expect UTG+1, and the CO to be drawring too. One of those three players you have to expect has an ace. IMO it's an easy fold on the flop - I don't think you're quite getting the correct value in respect of the pot and implied odds

Steve Griff

lmbree

03-10-2005, 09:00 AM

yeah, typo, meant flop, not preflop... Sorry to make a few of you lose your lunches.

pshabi

03-10-2005, 10:33 AM

You didn't just tell someone to fold KK preflop did you?