River Bluff Raise

[Alexthegreat]

Live 4/8

I'm in the BB with 6 /images/graemlins/club.gif2 /images/graemlins/club.gif

UTG raises and gets 6 cold calls....SB folds, I call

Flop is

4 /images/graemlins/club.gif5 /images/graemlins/heart.gif9 /images/graemlins/club.gif

I bet, UTG raises, Clears everyone out except for one other player, we'll call him the button, I call...

Turn is 7 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

I check, UTG checks, button checks

River is 6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

I check, UTG bets, Button folds, I checkraise....

Yep?
Nope?

[Dr. Jones]

I would checkraise the flop.

I think you're better off just betting out on the river.

[Alexthegreat]

a checkraise is better on the flop for sure....

I blanked out and forgot UTG raised and just auto-bet...stupid

I actually planned on checkfolding the river, but then the button folded and it was heads up and then I remembered UTG checked the turn, so maybe he doesn't have an overpair, and even if he does, he has played it weakly enough that maybe he'll fold if I raise...

Betting shuts out any bluff attemps, gets me a call from an overpair, and plus I still have to worry about the button....Betting is real bad here...

[Dr. Jones]

I just think if you're trying to represent a straight, you can do it better by betting.

If he's thinking at all he'll notice that if you really had it you wouldn't want the river to get checked through, especially after how the turn went.

If he's not thinking, he'll call your checkraise anyway with a big pair.

Actually I think the best play is to check and call. Let him bluff at it if he wants to, and don't lose two bets if he's really got it.

[Alexthegreat]

I wasn't looking to represent a straight on the river...betting into two players here is almost always going to get one call, and I can't really beat much of anything if anyone calls..

A thinking player is going to bet the turn with an overpair, and more often than not with overcards, so I wasn't really worried him thinking it through...

Check/calling is also a lousy option in my opinion....I don't want to see a showdown....I want him to fold

Does anyone think he has overcards here enough of the time for this to be correct?

[ThePenguin]

This is so crazy it might just work. Seriously, I like it. And i think definitely yes, he will have over-cards enough here to win. Not betting the turn may have given that away.

I'm curious though, what would you have done if either UTG or Button bets on the turn? Do you think you may check-raised UTG if he bets and button folds? Did you think about bettin out the turn?

[ThePenguin]

Personally, I would have played it the check/call way on the river, but I think this play might be better.

[mantasm]

It looks almost like a value checkraise when the button folds. UTG didn't play it like an overpair, it looks like his overcards missed.

A checkraise on the flop would be great. I'm not sure about the pf call, maybe any two suited is ok once you have 1000 or so coldcallers.

[ThePenguin]

I must be tired, I didn't even think about your aspect of the pre-flop play. Tell us, which profanities did UTG sputter when he called down and you won with 6 2?

[Alexthegreat]

Preflop: 7 players for 2 bets, me for one, It doesn't get much more standard than that...

Flop: Checkraise is better, yes, I know...

Turn: I don't consider betting, mainly because its good for me if it gets checked through, and although I don't think it's going to happen that often, I might just get a free look at the river...

River: If either UTG or the button had bet the turn, I would have check/folded...I don't think i'm good if there is a bet on the turn...I didn't think I was good on the river until the button folded...If UTG checks the river and the button bets, I fold...Pretty much I fold a blank river in every other scenario except the one that happened...