cold call this preflop? [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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iluzion

03-07-2005, 11:30 PM

AlmightyJay

03-07-2005, 11:30 PM

EDIT: Whoops, I thought Hero was button. I guess I'd call then.

GrunchCan

03-07-2005, 11:38 PM

I would definitely see a flop with 3-4 opponents.

PS: Its not really a cold-call since you already put money in the pot, but whatever.

KaiShin

03-07-2005, 11:40 PM

I would see a flop here.

Entity

03-07-2005, 11:40 PM

I would call, especially if the blinds are loose. It's a coolcall though, I think.

Rob

GrunchCan

03-07-2005, 11:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
It's a coolcall though, I think.

[/ QUOTE ]

A kewlcall. /images/graemlins/smile.gif I like that.

Shillx

03-07-2005, 11:44 PM

I would fold (as a reference - my VPIP is 15.2% but I get aces a lot).

Brad

GrunchCan

03-07-2005, 11:53 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would fold (as a reference - my VPIP is 15.2% but I get aces a lot).

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

My VPIP is higher. And going up.

Entity

03-07-2005, 11:58 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would fold (as a reference - my VPIP is 15.2% but I get aces a lot).

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

Surprising, dude. A9s with great relative position getting 1.5:6.5 immediate, but more likely 1.5:7.5, I think it's a call.

That said, I wouldn't hate a fold here, but I'm looking for a reason to play good hands, and relative position+donks trapped in between makes me happy.

If you can't find a fold on an AK7 nospade flop that gets hot and heavy, then a fold is certainly best, but I don't think you're that guy, Brad.

Rob

JerseyTom

03-08-2005, 12:04 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I would fold (as a reference - my VPIP is 15.2% but I get aces a lot).

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

Good god... You mean my VPIP is lower than yours? I seriously need to retool my game...

And yet (to OP), I call this w/ A9s.

Tom

iluzion

03-08-2005, 12:11 AM

I wasn't sure if it was a coldcall since it wasnt technically two bets with no previous contributation, but it was close heh. Anyway for what it matters. flop was 9xx one spade, I led, LP raised, all four players stayed in, turn was another random number, I checked and called LP's bet again, river gave me a flush as well as the guy after me, so i took down a 21.5BB pot.

Entity

03-08-2005, 12:12 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I wasn't sure if it was a coldcall since it wasnt technically two bets with no previous contributation, but it was close heh. Anyway for what it matters. flop was 9xx one spade, I led, LP raised, all four players stayed in, turn was another random number, I checked and called LP's bet again, river gave me a flush as well as the guy after me, so i took down a 21.5BB pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

Post the rest of the hand. I wanna see it.

Rob

iluzion

03-08-2005, 12:17 AM

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, 2 folds, CO raises, 1 fold, Hero calls, 1 fold, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif (4 players)
Hero bets, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, CO raises, Hero calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (8.50 BB) 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 bets, CO raises, Hero calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

River: (16.50 BB) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets, UTG+1 calls, CO folds, Hero raises, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

Final Pot: 22.50 BB

Results in white below: 
Hero has As 9s (flush, ace high).
UTG has Tc 9c (one pair, nines).
UTG+1 has 8c 7d (straight, nine high).
Outcome: Hero wins 22.50 BB. 

Eh, so it was two bets I called on the turn. I put my self on having 15 outs. 9 for flush, 4, 2 for trips. Was the turn a needed bet with so many outs? I knew it was going to be bet and prolly raised behind me otherwise I would have led myself.

Entity

03-08-2005, 12:18 AM

I don't like your flop play. The rest is good.

Rob

iluzion

03-08-2005, 12:20 AM

What would you do different?

btspider

03-08-2005, 12:21 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like your flop play. The rest is good.

Rob

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, check-raise flop.

are you opposed to a river bet? the 4 parts of a straight might scare CO's overpair.

zeropotential

03-08-2005, 12:21 AM

flop: perfect chance for a c/r preflop agressor most likely will bet out, and you can raise to protect your weak TP

iluzion

03-08-2005, 12:23 AM

im always nervous check-raising TPTK and strong draw hands on the flop, too scared it will get to the turn giving overcards a free card or me hitting my flush with not enough money in the pot to get callers on the big bet.

tytygoodnuts

03-08-2005, 12:24 AM

I would checkraise the flop.

milesdyson

03-08-2005, 12:26 AM

I would bet the river. Check raising the CO faces two for two cold, and worse, he may just check through with three to the straight and three /images/graemlins/spade.gifs on the board.

tytygoodnuts

03-08-2005, 12:26 AM

[ QUOTE ]
im always nervous check-raising TPTK and strong draw hands on the flop, too scared it will get to the turn giving overcards a free card or me hitting my flush with not enough money in the pot to get callers on the big bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

Naah dude, protecting your hand is important. The preflop raiser is almost sure to bet.

iluzion

03-08-2005, 12:27 AM

I _really_ did not see this checking through, though.

zeropotential

03-08-2005, 12:27 AM

yes you should be nervous: but this isn't that time...

there was a pre-flop agressor which makes it more likely he will bet out if its checked to him. when you bet out the pot lies 10-1 making it correct to call with draws with as few as 4 out... you can't bet out here b/c it dosn't protect your hand!

milesdyson

03-08-2005, 12:29 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I _really_ did not see this checking through, though.

[/ QUOTE ]
Well, did you plan on check raising CO? The absolute max you get from this is a net of 2 BB if the others don't call two cold. I know you didn't know that UTG was going to bet it. It worked out well this time, but overall I think betting is better. It may even get raised behind you, allowing you to 3-bet.

iluzion

03-08-2005, 12:31 AM

I get where your coming from now, that does make alot more sense to bet out. Just as I played the hand I was like "yeah one will raise and i can check raise to get two bets out of them" didnt think that it could be the CO betting, and then me forcing them out where they would have called one bet twice.

Entity

03-08-2005, 12:35 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I don't like your flop play. The rest is good.

Rob

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, check-raise flop.

are you opposed to a river bet? the 4 parts of a straight might scare CO's overpair.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't see this river not getting bet. Hehe. I love double negatives. I also think the other guys are calling really often, but aren't raising very often. So a checkraise needs to work ~50% of the time here to show more profit, and I think it's ok here. I just don't think the donks are folding for two bets.