bet or take the free card?

[2005]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (10 handed) converter

MP2 (t3305)
Hero (t1230)
CO (t1613)
Button (t1325)
SB (t3810)
BB (t1380)
UTG (t915)
UTG+1 (t1712)
UTG+2 (t2805)
MP1 (t535)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif, K /images/graemlins/spade.gif.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls t100, 3 folds, Hero calls t100, 2 folds, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t400) T /images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 3 /images/graemlins/spade.gif, J /images/graemlins/diamond.gif (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, Hero ?

[SossMan]

take the freebie because of your stack size. If you had a WPT sized deep stack, then I'd probably stab at it now with a small bet and take the freebie on the turn if it blanks out.

[2005]

yeah, right after I made the bet I didn't like it.

Gavin

[MLG]

If your gonna bet it should just be a push. You can't fold if you get played back at. If you do push I think you're very likely to have 14 outs if you get called. Picking up the 400 in the pot is pretty nice for your stack though, especially if the blinds are going to go up shortly.

[edfilan]

What read did you have on UTG+1? Was he likely to limp from EP with a strong holding? Nearing short stack territory, I might be inclined to push preflop. I also like the push postflop. There's already $400 in the pot and everyone checked to you. I have to believe a J would have bet. Even so, with overs, you're a coin flip anyway. By calling, you allow the flush draw to see another card also. If you hit, you are not likely to get action (unless someone was slow playing 2-pair or trips).

[NumbersGame]

I would make a pot sized to 1 1/4 times the pot. This is a good semibluff opportunity. If you get called then more likely you will need some luck. But with blinds going up very soon this is a good bet.

[Elaboration]

Gavin,

FWIW I like pushing. I think a J would bet here, you'll likely fold a T and shut out the diamond draws. A set of 3s might sneak up on you, but you have your outs.
What would be your turn plan if you check and the turn whiffs and you are then faced with a bet?

Thanks-

[MLG]

on party, folding a 10 is questionable. I still like the play, but your gonna get called by 10s in a lot of spots.

[Sam T.]

Unless the table has been extremely passive, I'm not sure I like the pre-flop limp for almost 10% (8%) of your stack with two players and the blinds left to act. If someone is in a pwning mood, you have to fold or push all-in with a marginal hand.

On the flop, I'd go ahead and push. Most of your overs are probably good the OESD makes me happy. If someone wants to call with a flush draw, good for them, and hopefully good for you.

My two cents,

Sam

[2005]

K, well, being braindead, I bet 300 on the flop. UTG+1 called. Turn is a blank spade, now push or check?

Gavin

[MLG]

check. hope you hit one of your nine bazillion outs. If you blank and he checks the river then push and hope he was on the diamond draw (or will fold second pair).

[schwza]

[ QUOTE ]
K, well, being braindead, I bet 300 on the flop. UTG+1 called. Turn is a blank spade, now push or check?

Gavin

[/ QUOTE ]

you have 830 in a 1000 pot. if utg+1 is the type to limp A9s utg+1, i think he'll make a bad call here if you push the turn. i don't think he's going to let go AQs with the flush draw and gut shot. if he called you on the flop with AJ/KJ, he's going to the felt. the only hand that i see him calling the flop and folding to a turn bet is AT.

i'd take the free card.

[SossMan]

I assume he checked to you on the turn, too.

Pot =1000. You have 900 left. You have anywhere from 14-20 outs. I think that the FE you may have from a hand like AQ or a mid pair warrents pushing here. I think that seeing a free river would be okay too. It feels pretty close.

[MLG]

The thing is, i think you will have that FE on the river also if you blank here. Also, one thing I've learned the hard way is that the FE you have on Party is generally about half of what you think it is.

[SossMan]

fair enough.

[Elaboration]

[ QUOTE ]
(or will fold second pair).

[/ QUOTE ]

If you thought the chances of the enemy folding a T on the flop where slim, they have to be virtually non existant after hero checks the turn. Don't you think?
By pushing, aren't you basically trying to get missed A high flush draw to fold, otherwise you might have the best hand?

Thanks-

[MLG]

Yes, you are primarily hoping he will fold an A, any A. It is probably unlikely that he will fold 2nd pair here, but given your stack and the amount of money in the pot, you have to try.

[sdplayerb]

with a deeper stack i take the free card. but here i would bet at it (but i would not have limped in the first place).
If I get played back at, I'm potcomitted, which is fine.

[2005]

ALRIGHT, I GOT SOMETHING RIGHT!!! I checked. River was a K. He bet like 125. I called, MHIG

Gavin

[Roman]

If the table has been passive/weak, I either put in a strong bet or push flop, whatever looks scarier to them. I want the max amount of FE here.

Once you get to the turn, I take the freebie even though bluffing the river isnt that convincing and is only gonna fold out Ace high draws.