top pair, 2nd kicker, small stack

[rhinoceros]

still at PP no limit Holdem, the very next hand, I hold Kh Td with only $11. EP limps, EP poster checks, I limp, LP and SB limp. I know this is a marginal hand (at best) but I am thinking it is an appropriate hand for a small stack. Or am I just steamed? 6 see the flop:

Tc 8s 2d

4 check to me. The pot is $3. I bet $3, LP calls, the rest fold.

Turn: Js

I bet $7.50 all-in, he calls

River: 3s

He wins with Qc 9d.

Thoughts and suggestions?

[Lurker]

Well, he was 12-1 to hit on the turn and you certainly didn't pay him off any more than that. The only way you can NOT pay him off (badly) is if you know he hit the straight and you check-fold.

IMO your thinking about preflop hand selection is a little backwards. Marginal hands are for big stacks, not small ones.

Bad beat for you.

[rhinoceros]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
IMO your thinking about preflop hand selection is a little backwards. Marginal hands are for big stacks, not small ones.


[/ QUOTE ]
I was thinking that in the flop confrontation between a pair and a draw, the draw prefers the money to be deep. Then, if the draw hits, it can get paid. So suited connectors and so forth I will play only with a big stack, while with unsuited high cards and a short stack, I will loosen my standards. Strength is not my primary consideration.

However, I have only small confidence that this logic is valid; I'm a weak NL player (as you can see from the hands I post). And, even if this logic is valid, perhaps KTo is still inadequate? Any other thoughts out there on this issue?

I think an arguement could be made for getting involved in hands with big, unsuited cards with a small stack, since the game will play closer to limit. However, I'd need a chance at getting it heads up. KTo is not a hand you want to play against 5 opponents in NL.

Now in all forms of poker, you always have to be asking yourself, what does my opponent have? I don't know if you did that here. What hands did you put him on when he called you. Some possible hands are:
88, 22, AT-9T, QJ, Q9, J9, J7, T8, 97.
Now, when the Jack hits, how may can you beat?:
QT, T9.
Some hands you can't beat may fold (AT &amp; KT, particularly), but that Jack was pretty bad for you. Going all-in here will lose money.

The best piece of advice I can offer you, though, is not to play marginal hands after getting aces cracked. Take a break. I've seen too many people bust out 1 or 2 hands after losing most of their chips. If you're wondering if you were steaming, then you were certainly on tilt of some form. You can't be on tilt in NL. Ever. When you're 100% sure you're ready, come back and buy in for more than $11. You can't really play the game without a stack.

[Ray Zee]

if you play hands in no limit that arent very good, you must be playing them with the intention that you can win the pot without hitting your hand. i dont see you doing this with your hand here. i would have folded before the flop, OR raised before the flop to be able to make a play after when you miss, OR checkraise on the flop all in to get it headup with maybe the best hand, or win it right there.
dont play marginal hands trying to catch a miracle flop to win a small pot. even the big boys with the big stacks dont play garbage unless its a spot they hope they can steal from when they miss and it looks like a bluff can win it.
another major point to make is that king ten is not a hand with two big cards. it does terribly in multiway pots.

[Amanjyaku]

You better give us your thinking on KT. Do you think of it as two big cards, or do you think of it as a drawing hand? I think of it as a drawing hand that can make a nut straight or top full in a situation where nobody thinks I'm playing it. This is what I hope for with a big stack against another big stack.

If I played it in your position, I would much rather hit the ten than the king, as you did. You were drawn out on.

He made a bad call on the flop. A gutshot isn't worth calling a pot-size bet when the better has such a small stack.