BB/100 on PT evens out at...30k?

[Belok]

I consider myself a very good player, at least when compared to the rest of the clowns playing 2/4. Over the last 20k hands, I have averaged 0.36BB/100. It was closer to 0.1BB/100 before last night when i made 211$ over 4500 hands.

I dont completely understand why my stats are so low. It could very well just be variance giving me a hard time, but if there are any holes in my game, id like to get them fixed before i end up with a 50k sample size and 0.36BB/100.

Generic stats:
VP$IP - 13.13
VP$ from SB - 20.47
Folded SB to steal - 84.68
Folded BB to steal - 71.82
Att To Steal - 20.24
Went to SD - 29.51
Won $ At SD - 57.08 (i'm proud of this, but maybe too high?)
PF Raise - 7.06

Hands of note - All of my big pairs are a standard 3BB/hand(AA) through 1.5BB/hand (JJ)
The ones ringing alarm bells are:
(hand) (BB/Hand)
AKs - 0.17
AKo - 0.29
AQo - 0.20
A6s, A5s, and A3s are all negative, the rest are slightly positive
ATo is slightly negative with a VP$IP of 33
KQs is pretty far negative (0.17). My VP$IP with it is 96, is that high?
KQo down to KTo are all positive
QQ-Q9s and JJ-J9s look pretty standard

Pairs 99 and below are where I think i may be making the most mistakes...either that or its the variance.
99, 77, 66, 55, 33, and 22 are all negative, and i've had each about 70-100 times.
Hand VP$IP
99 - 92.52 (high?)
88 - 84.21 (positive)
77 - 70.65
66 - 43.09
55 - 41.41
44 - 33.77 (positive)
33 - 24.71
22 - 18.35
My guess is that 66-22 should all have the same vp$ip of around 30-40, and 77-99 should all be around 80. But input is greatly appreciated.

So if anybody sees any holes, id really be thankful for a critique of the stats.

Thx,
Dan

*edit*
I think position stats would help analysis...
(position) (vpip) (BB/hand)
Button - 15.79 - 0.09
1 - 13.72 - 0.01
2 - 14.71 - 0.13
3 - 12.50 - 0.07
4 - 11.04 - 0.05
5 - 8.60 - 0.06
6 - 8.84 - 0.02
7 - 7.86 - 0.03
BB - 10.22 - (0.26)
SB - 20.47 - (0.10)

[young nut]

A couple suggestions for you.
1. I think you need to loosen up just a tad. 13VPIP is kinda low, so maybe browse through your starting hand strategy and find a few that you can add.

2. Maybe consider loosening up a little when in the small blind. Like if there are 4 or 5 limpers, complete with anything suited or high offsuit connectors.

3. I think your VPIP for pocket 4's-7's should be higher than 40%. I am about 60% VPIP with those pocket pairs and am only in the negative on one. Still make sure you don't play them to a raise.

Just remember, 30k is still somewhat small and variance can skew your numbers pretty bad. Maybe check your stats for check/raises and total aggression, you might not be protecting your hands enough. Also, post hands that you feel like you need help with.

P.s. if you could post your aggression stats that would help analyze postflop play.

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
VP$IP - 13.13

[/ QUOTE ]

You're way too tight. My first 10K hands my VPIP was 12% and then I learned I was missing a TON of +EV situations. I've pushed it to 15% and I'm still working on getting it higher as I get more comfortable with marginal situations. This has increased my BB/100 signifcantly. What do you do with position and 77 after a limper, a raise and a cold-call? KQs? JTs on the Button after a limper, a raise and a few cold-calls?

I recommend reading Nate Tha' Great's post (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/favlinker.php?Cat=&Entry=73858&F_Board=holdem&Thre ad=1767198&partnumber=&postmarker=).

[ QUOTE ]
PF Raise - 7.06

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a little low but is similar to my old numbers. You're probably missing some isolation raises, for example. What do you do with AQ and 99 after a raise from an average player? Do you ever trying buying the Button in LP after a couple of weak limpers and tight players behind you with some of the more marginal hands? What do you do on the Button with A8s? In the BB with QJs after a lot of limpers? I mix it up, depending on the players and number of players, but I've been raising in these situations.

I'm only a novice; some of the more experienced posters will be able to tell you a lot more. But since your numbers are very similar to my old numbers, I thought I'd share a rough idea of how I changed my game.

Good luck.

[Belok]

Sorry, forgot about aggression factor.
Flop: 3.12
Turn: 2.28
River: 1.89

As for my tightness, looking through the hands that I could add, there really probably isnt more than .5BB/100 worth of value left. And I am sure it is possible to hit close to 2BB/100 as tight as I am preflop.

Jason, in your situations - AQ and 99 I reraise, A8s on the button i raise unless it is a big multiway limped pot, and I check QJs on the BB after a lot of limpers.

Maybe loosening up in the SB would help up my VP$IP some and maybe add another .1BB/100 or so. But that really isnt an amazing amount.

My confidence level at 2/4 is amazing, and Id go to 3/6 if i could just pull off 1 or more BB/100 at 2/4.

I can go into a room with playerview on and after the stats have loaded i can almost always pick out 7-8 people in the room that i am 100% sure I am a better player than. Generally there are 1 or 2 players with 2+2er stats, and I can adapt enough that when i'm in a pot with them, I take advantage of the systematic low limit 2+2er style to make extra bets (usually I only end up in pots with them in overpair vs overpair or AK v AQish situations, but when they happen, it is very easy to tell when i need to call down, and when a checkraise is near guaranteed to work and make me more money)

Anyway, before I worry about upping my VPIP any more (it used to be 11...) I want to fix any holes that are in my current 13

[SinCityGuy]

Get that steal % up to at least 30%.

Play more hands in the CO and button. Your VP$IP should be a few points higher there.

[young nut]

[ QUOTE ]

Anyway, before I worry about upping my VPIP any more (it used to be 11...) I want to fix any holes that are in my current 13

[/ QUOTE ]

Your post doesn't really have much content as to the way you play your hands. It seemed to me that your questions were all about your starting hands. The only way to analyze your play is to post hands that you think you need help with. Maybe you aren't check raising enough? Your turn aggression looks like it should be a little higher methinks.

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
Anyway, before I worry about upping my VPIP any more (it used to be 11...) I want to fix any holes that are in my current 13

[/ QUOTE ]

This is hard to analyze without specific hands to look at. Post in SS.

[SomethingClever]

FWIW, my winrate after 20k at 2/4 was IDENTICAL to yours. 0.36/100.

I suck, though.

[Emmitt2222]

And when he says suck he means really good which does show that you can run particularly bad for 20k hands. I would suggest that you don't try to get confortable with that 13vpip like you seem to want to, try to push that number because I think you are missing important concepts. For one, you don't appear to steal enough, you are most likely not raising marginal hands in late position to steal the blinds enough like Ax. vpip, pfr and blind steal I think all really need to increase. Minimum for vpip I would say should be 15, pfr of 8 and blind steal of 25%. Just my suggestions.

[Munga30]

You're much too tight the whole way through.

Preflop: way way way too tight. Not even cracking 16% on the button??? You have to take off the training wheels (http://archiveserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=smallholdem&Number=495010& Forum=f3&Words="training%20wheels"&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Main=495010&Search=true&whe re=bodysub&Name=43&daterange=1&newerval=2&newertyp e=y&olderval=&oldertype=&bodyprev=#Post495010) and start looking for reasons to play against these 2/4 players (especially if you are as good as you think you are).

Postflop: Your went to SD is a little low, which, by itself, could be a sign that you're just running bad. But your W$SD is high, much too high. THIS IS NOT A GOOD THING. It ver likely means you are folding too often postflop. Suppose you only call on the river when you have the absolute nuts and fold otherwise. Your W$@SD would be 100% but clearly you would be a losing player!!! Good numbers (I wanted to say targets, but you shouldn't be aiming for these, per se) would be to get to SD in the low to mid 30s and win $ just a hair over 50%. Some winning players are even just under.

Good luck.

[cnfuzzd]

Your sample size is so small as to be meaningless, so dont draw ANY conclusions from it. Remember, its possible to have break even or even losing MONTHS, so i wouldnt worry about what your stats say. Post hands, comment on others hands, and make sure and listen to what others are telling you. Keep growing.

FWIW, my current winrate at 2/4 is something like 12BB/100 over around 12K hands. FISH. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

peace

john nickle

[SmileyEH]

At 2/4 with a SD of about 15BB/100, with 95% certainty your winrate is +-2BB/100.

Therefore you are about a -2BB to 2BB/100 winner/loser. Maybe you are going through a downswing, but regardless you are not beating the game anywhere near enough. I would think it nearly impossible for a player beating the 2/4 game near optimally to break even over 10k hands, let alone 20k hands.

You need to loosen up and be more agressive preflop.

-SmileyEH

[stinkypete]

fold less, bet and raise more.

your aggression factors "look" okay, but if it's deceptive because you fold too much.

[Shillx]

Too tight, not aggressive enough before the flop, fold too much after the flop. It looks like you don't defend enough.

You play WAY to tight at this limit. You are missing out on lots of +EV spots. My VPIP is too tight but it is going up. Something like 18% might be a good number to shoot for.

Brad