Cheating in teams

[cianosheehan]

Is it possible to cheat on the internet using MSN messenger and the like to share hand knowledge? Do you think many people do this? And what do the internet companies do to stop people like this? What are the chances of me playing at the same table as these cheaters?

[karokari]

It is possible. But just stay away from William Hill(crypto?) and you should be fine, there is lot of collusion going on. Other sites are pretty clean.

And for you its easy to spot it, and even if you just suspect it contact the poker room and they will look at it.

[BUD]

KAROKARI you have the best avatar on this forum! Everyone has to see that! that is some real talent!

[carlo]

Karo, would you please elucidate furthur the crypto collusion--just opened an account and would like to be aware>

regards,
carlo

[kdog]

[ QUOTE ]
It is possible. But just stay away from William Hill(crypto?) and you should be fine, there is lot of collusion going on. Other sites are pretty clean.

And for you its easy to spot it, and even if you just suspect it contact the poker room and they will look at it.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a very serious accusation to make against a site. If you have proof put it out here for all to see (hand historys, chat logs,etc). If all you have are suspiscions then that's ALL you should say.

Two other points:
1- There are 9 or 10 sites that feed players into the Cryptologic games. How would you know these colluders were from Will Hill?

2- The majority of games there are tight assed, bonus whore loaded $1-2 games. There's no profit to be made colluding in those and the higher limit games are sparse enough that the savvier players would have spotted any teams before now.

[IggyWH]

[ QUOTE ]
Is it possible to cheat on the internet using MSN messenger and the like to share hand knowledge? Do you think many people do this? And what do the internet companies do to stop people like this? What are the chances of me playing at the same table as these cheaters?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's very easy to do, highly undetectable by the sites and I would also suspect that it is more common than many people might think.

That said though, I think it would be hard to organize it with more than just 2 people sharing hole cards to each other. Knowing 2 extra cards over everyone else, while possibly effective, doesn't give you that huge of an advantage over others.

[hate]

I don't get any of this [censored], seriously. This is all alarmism because one obvious bot got spotted awhile ago. I play all the time with a friend of mine. I don't share hole cards, and I'll take his stack like a motherfucker if I can. I think a lot of people are like this. You should read all the [censored] on the pokertracker forums, "PLEASE PAT PLEASE PUT IN A COLLUSION DETECTOR THANKS". It's [censored] gambling online. If you can't handle it, then go to a goddamn brick and mortar where cheating is at a whole new level of sophistication.

[cianosheehan]

I think it is around,I dont see why it wouldnt be. Most poker players probably have stemmed from home game origins, and obviously are friends with other poker enthusiasts. Thus if two guys who are friends are both playing online poker, what would stop them from getting the bright idea of sitting at the same table as a team? Its a concept that isnt entirely difficult to think of, as well is put into practise.

So my questions stand, what do the sites do stop this, and what effect does it have (if primarily invisible) on internet poker as a whole?

[hate]

I'm saying it's relatively impossible to stop, because there's going to be little to no discernable difference between me colluding with my friend and me playing against him like I'd do anybody else. Chip-dumping is easy enough to spot. What I'm saying is that this is worthless alarmism, I don't see people going out to protest in the front lawns in gibraltar about how unfair this world is treating us with so many cheaters.

[IggyWH]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't get any of this [censored], seriously. This is all alarmism because one obvious bot got spotted awhile ago. I play all the time with a friend of mine. I don't share hole cards, and I'll take his stack like a motherfucker if I can. I think a lot of people are like this. You should read all the [censored] on the pokertracker forums, "PLEASE PAT PLEASE PUT IN A COLLUSION DETECTOR THANKS". It's [censored] gambling online. If you can't handle it, then go to a goddamn brick and mortar where cheating is at a whole new level of sophistication.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not complaining about it, but you're very nieve if you think it doesn't happen just because you don't do it.

I once had a friend I know sit at my table and soon after, he IM me his hole cards on one hand. He didn't mean anything by it because he's not that smart to realize it's an advantage as far as the #'s go. I told him to quit telling me his hole cards as it is wrong.

He still didn't get it so I tried to explain odds to him. He's not a poker player in the least bit so it took a while for the odds to soak in for him to understand it. Even the moron that he is, he said to me "just think how easy it is for anyone to do this".

It is done, and probably is done on a regular basis in games since it is so easy and so hard to detect.

[cianosheehan]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm saying it's relatively impossible to stop, because there's going to be little to no discernable difference between me colluding with my friend and me playing against him like I'd do anybody else. Chip-dumping is easy enough to spot. What I'm saying is that this is worthless alarmism, I don't see people going out to protest in the front lawns in gibraltar about how unfair this world is treating us with so many cheaters.

[/ QUOTE ]

So your point is that colluding with your friend doesnt give you a signifcant advantage over others at the table?

[hate]

I'm saying it gives me an advantage of sorts, but you're wasting your time crying over it, and you're wasting your time thinking ways to fix it. Most people are too goddamn stupid to take advantage of collusion, and knowing another person's hole cards is only a portion of it. I don't think it doesn't happen, I think it doesn't goddamn matter. I'm not naieve, and I'm not honorable. I'd collude with somebody else if I felt the benefits outweighed the risks and the stupidity of automating telling others my hole cards.

[party36master]

There's going to be a lot more cheating if Party doesn't do something to stop that damn obvious bot.

[cianosheehan]

What bot?

[Utah]

Yes. It happens and I have been cheated on Pokerstars. Out of the blue I got a message from them saying you have been cheated by a team and they gave me a refund.

Not overly concerned about it though. As long as I continue to win I am comfortable playing.