Ugly line

[Zele]

UTG is unknown. For the record, I almost never try to induce a river bluff from a PP 5/10 unknown.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, Hero calls.

Flop: (4.40 SB) A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 6/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: (3.20 BB) A/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls.

River: (5.20 BB) J/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, UTG checks.

Final Pot: 5.20 BB

[Grisgra]

What's with the goofy turn lead? It's weird enough that you might get as something as lame as K-high to call, as it smells incredibly fishy, at least.

[Zele]

[ QUOTE ]
What's with the goofy turn lead? It's weird enough that you might get as something as lame as K-high to call, as it smells incredibly fishy, at least.

[/ QUOTE ]

That was my idea. Seems pretty sophomoric, but I thought "daring" him to call me was my best bet for action I could beat.

BTW, excellent guess. He showed down KQo.

[Grisgra]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What's with the goofy turn lead? It's weird enough that you might get as something as lame as K-high to call, as it smells incredibly fishy, at least.

[/ QUOTE ]

That was my idea. Seems pretty sophomoric, but I thought "daring" him to call me was my best bet for action I could beat.

BTW, excellent guess. He showed down KQo.

[/ QUOTE ]

Given your "I'll pretend I'm a donk" line, going for the river bluff made sense, I think, though I can see betting and hoping he has a pocket. I don't know that if you checked the turn that he'd bet there, and if he bet and you raised, he almost definitely folds.

So I guess: nice turn bet!

[rmarotti]

I'm just starting out in shorthanded 5/10 after playing .5/1-5/10 full, so forgive me if this is a stupid question, but is the standard line on the turn to c/call (and let him keep betting) or c/raise?

Thanks,
rm

[Grisgra]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm just starting out in shorthanded 5/10 after playing .5/1-5/10 full, so forgive me if this is a stupid question, but is the standard line on the turn to c/call (and let him keep betting) or c/raise?

Thanks,
rm

[/ QUOTE ]

Depends on his aggression level. The standard line, as you're out of position and can't rely on a river bet, is to checkraise the turn, I think. Against *really* aggressive folks, you can try to checkraise the river -- though frankly against those folks, betting the turn is still probably better because you can then 3-bet it!

Against a somewhat tight slighty observant player (I'd say that most 5/10 players are in that category, they aren't all loose passives) the turn bet is very nifty here because they'd expect that if you had an ace, you'd checkraise them on that turn. And they're worried that you have an ace anyway because you called the flop.

The turn bet smells of desperation/a stupid and really fishy bluff. That's why I like it here!

[Chobohoya]

I really dont see him betting anything on the river here. If you're going to lead the turn, I would definitely lead the river. But I kind of like check-call, c/r for the turn/river.

[Zele]

Depends on your read. Sorry for the copout answer, but it really does. If he's a thinking player, it also depends on his read of you. For example, if you're reasonably sure he'll bet the river, unless you believe he'll call down a CR with a good range of hands.

Against an unknown, I'm not sure, so I mix it up with goofy lines like this one.

[Zele]

[ QUOTE ]
Against a somewhat tight slighty observant player (I'd say that most 5/10 players are in that category, they aren't all loose passives)

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with you, which is a sign we have both been playing too much internet SH poker. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

It's all relative.

[Danenania]

I like this line except I always bet the river, as drawing a river call from something like KQo or 55 is the whole point of this line.

[Grisgra]

[ QUOTE ]
I like this line except I always bet the river, as drawing a river call from something like KQo or 55 is the whole point of this line.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, you're right -- at this point your opponent is so befuddled as to what the hell is going on that you really can't expect him to bluff the river. He's in his shell at this point with KQ or 55. Only thing that's bluffing maybe is Q-high.

[Zele]

Indeed, definite value in a river bet, especially given what I'm representing (nothing) and what he plausibly has (the possible best hand, but not worth a bet).

Thanks for the responses, guys.