JJ Early in B&M Tourney

[i wanna be me]

early in B&M $100 NL Tournament
Blinds are 15/30 - starting stacks $1000 (currently have $700 after qq getting rocked)

I'm in MP with J /images/graemlins/heart.gif J /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

Folded to me - I make it 100 to go (3xBB raises have been winning blinds consistently)

Button calls (has roughly $700) - SB and BB fold (295 in pot)

Button is pretty poor - calls way too much on draws

Flop K /images/graemlins/diamond.gif Q /images/graemlins/diamond.gif J /images/graemlins/club.gif

Hero? (answer before looking down)
























Turn 6 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

Hero?

[crookedhat99]

I would push the flop. it makes him pay for the draw, call with two pair or a pair, or it take's the pot down right there (which you'd have to be satisfied with because of the scarieness of that flop).

[Shilly]

I'd lead out for 300 on the flop. If he raises, push, if he just calls, push any non-scary turn.

It's up to you how you play if say, an A or a T falls (a ten would be much scarier, in my opinion). I wouldn't worry too much about diamonds. In this case with the 6 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif on the turn, I'd push (on the turn).

[tiger7210]

Depends a bit on opponent here. I want to get all my chips in here. If I'm confident he'll bet If I check then I'll check raise all- in but your PF raise then check on the flop looks a bit fishy. Normally I would lead out here with a 2/3 size bet and hope he comes over the top. One way or another I'm going to the felt with it and if I get cold decked or outdrawn then so be it. If he simply flat calls and the turn is another /images/graemlins/diamond.gif then I bet 1/2 the pot on the turn and make the crying call if he pushes over the top but if he doesn't have the flush he may think I do and am trying to now extract more from him by only betting 1/2 the pot. One way or another I'm not folding here heads up.

[schwza]

definite bet, especially knowing button calls too much with draws. make it about 250 and push any turn except maybe the A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif or 9 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif. anything else and too much of a chance he was on the other draw for you to check since the pot will be ~800 and you only have 350 left.

[yecul]

I would bet the pot or CR all-in, but I'd have to be pretty confident he'd bet at it. Even against a flush/straight you have some outs. I wouldn't fool around on that flop.

[i wanna be me]

On the flop I bet 2/3 the pot and he called (uh oh).

Turn was the 6 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

I wasn't scared of the flush....WAS scared of the straight.
Bet 1/2 the pot (mistake - probably a push) and he called again (??)

River was the 2 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

I checked (didn't think I had J /images/graemlins/diamond.gif) and he checked behind.

He shows A /images/graemlins/club.gif 8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif (???)
I win with flush.

Lesson learned - I'm assuming I have to push that turn?

[schwza]

you put in 100 pre-flop and there's 245 in the pot (not 295) and you have 600 left. you bet 160, so pot is 565 and you have 400 left on the turn. if you bet, it's a push. (and look back at your cards if you're not sure.)

[Bernas]

There is nothing wrong with making him pay to see the turn but a push would be a bad play. A 2/3 pot sized bet isn't giving him the correct odds unless he is holding 2 diamonds and one of them is the 10.

With a push, I think you are only called by better hands. Either a made straight or a straight and flush draw.

[i wanna be me]

yeah i realized i made 2 mistakes:

1. I forgot my card suits (a testament to my lack of B&M experience)
2. displaying my information was inaccurate (thought I'd put in 125 PF)

I've only been playing NL for a month and a bit....I'm having a tough time calculating when and when not to push. I think the biggest leak in my game is not gaining fold equity when I have the opportunity to do so....are there general guidelines on when pushing (and, similarly, the stop-n-go later in tournaments) are good plays?

p.s. doesn't pushing (as opposed to betting 2/3 the pot) just invite better hands to call?

[Bernas]

Yes it does, which is why a push on the flop is bad.
You want to get the maximum number of chips possible from your hand, not lose the maximum amount possible.

2/3 or a pot sized bet is correct. If he calls on just a flush or a straight draw then he is making a mistake.

[schwza]

[ QUOTE ]
1. I forgot my card suits (a testament to my lack of B&M experience)

[/ QUOTE ]

my little mnemonic:

/images/graemlins/spade.gif /images/graemlins/club.gif black
/images/graemlins/diamond.gif /images/graemlins/heart.gif red
/images/graemlins/spade.gif /images/graemlins/heart.gif major
/images/graemlins/diamond.gif /images/graemlins/club.gif minor (from bridge)
/images/graemlins/heart.gif /images/graemlins/club.gif beatles (sgt pepper's lonely heart club)
/images/graemlins/spade.gif /images/graemlins/diamond.gif wacky (couldn't think of anything better)

as a general rule, i'd say it's pretty rarely correct to bet more than 1/2 your stack instead of pushing.

[Bernas]

Any bet on the turn should be a push.

[i wanna be me]

thanks for the help guys - this was the only hand where i forgot my suits for some reason?!? anyways thanks for the >1/2 stack push rule - makes sense to me (given I'm not Hellmuth).

p.s. do you push if the turn is a blank?

[schwza]

[ QUOTE ]
thanks for the help guys - this was the only hand where i forgot my suits for some reason?!? anyways thanks for the >1/2 stack push rule - makes sense to me (given I'm not Hellmuth).

p.s. do you push if the turn is a blank?

[/ QUOTE ]

yep. don't want him folding a draw on the river.