Yet another Big pair question

[RickyG]

Lately I seem to be loosing alot with big pocket pairs. Most of them have been all-in preflop w/aces and get sucked out. I will continue to go all in with aces preflop when I can pull it off. The question then becomes, what about when I dont get all in. Such as here:

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG+2 ($23.75)
MP1 ($24.25)
MP2 ($29.15)
MP3 ($25.9)
CO ($15.35)
Button ($55.95)
Hero ($25.9)
BB ($34.7)
UTG ($37.7)
UTG+1 ($60.5)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/heart.gif. Hero posts a blind of $0.25.
<font color="#666666">6 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises to $2</font>, Button calls $2, <font color="#CC3333">Hero (poster) raises to $5.75</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, CO calls $4, Button calls $4.

Flop: ($18.50) 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
Hero calls $19.90 (All-In), CO calls $9.35 (All-In), Button calls $19.90.

Turn: ($67.65) 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players, 2 all-in)</font>

River: ($67.65) 4/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players, 2 all-in)</font>

Final Pot: $67.65

Cut off Had AsTs - Pair of tens on flop
Button had 3c3h - set of 3's on flop.

Did I just get unlucky, or how should I play this hand post-flop? My guess is that I probably played it too fast. The only (good) player that could call me would have me beat with two pair (in which case I have plenty outs), or a set (in which case 2 outs). But on PP it seems that I would get called by weaker hands more often (IE the ATs). Any Ideas. It was probably my 20th hand on the table . Cutoff was a pretty aggressive player that would have raised the blinds with pretty much any ace, dont know much about button.

[PoBoy321]

Honestly I don't think that there's any way that I'm going to get away from this hand after the flop. If one of them hit a set on you, those are the breaks, but be comforted in the fact that neither of them had the odds to do so.

[kurto]

You got sucked out on.

If you know they're going to call with hands like these, you might want to limp-raise all in? I'm betting they'd call.

I think you just just chalk this one to bad luck.

And I don't know that the bb's call was so bad. He called ~$3 more into a pot of $10 with a possibility of winnning $40 more.... I'm tired but isn't he 5-1 to hit his set?

[Post-Oak]

[ QUOTE ]

I'm tired but isn't he 5-1 to hit his set?


[/ QUOTE ]

No. 7.5 to 1.

[PoBoy321]

5-1 if he sees all 5 cards. It's about 8-1 or 9-1 to flop a set, so basically, he needs to get about 10X his money when he flops a set for this to be a profitable play. Given that he was calling $5.75 before the flop to win $40, this can never be a profitable play for him.

[Post-Oak]

[ QUOTE ]
5-1 if he sees all 5 cards. It's about 8-1 or 9-1 to flop a set,

[/ QUOTE ]

It's 7.5 to 1 against flopping a set. In other words, he will flop a set 1 out of 8.5 times.

And he would win 1 out of 5 times if he was all-in against you preflop (and so was gonna see 5 cards no matter what). Which means he is a 4 to 1 dog.

I think the whole "to one" term confuses some people.

[kurto]

The only thing to consider is... does he definitely put the raiser on huge pocket pair? If there's a decent chance raiser has AK or the like, his call looks better.

The question is would the hero reraise with a hand like AK?

[RickyG]

well, I was on the SB on this hand. It was the cutoff who raised and the button who caled the raise and the reraise cold with his 3's. I thought I played it correctly pre-flop, it was more the flop that I was looking for help on. It seems though that the general consesus is to do the same thing every time a similar situation comes up. The sad thing is this happened to me twice today, once with aces and once with kings. Just wanted to make sure that I wasnt making a huge mistake with these big pairs.

I welcome any more comments you have.

[Kaz The Original]

I make this 7 or 8 preflop.

[TheWorstPlayer]

[ QUOTE ]
I make this 7 or 8 preflop.

[/ QUOTE ]
Me too. But it won't change the outcome. But when they miss, you will make more which will balance it all out.