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View Full Version : Good Lay Down or Weak Tight?


Mynok
02-23-2005, 12:17 PM
I've been agonizing over this fold I made last night. I've been studying SSH pretty thoroughly over the past month or so and I've definitely made big improvements to my game. I was a weak tight player before, and I think I'm on my way to becoming a tight/aggressive one. I'm trying to determine if this play is a backslide into my wussy days or a proper laydown.

Set-up: I've been at the table for about two orbits. I don't have great reads on the individual players yet, but all in all the table seems pretty juicy: about 4-6 see the flop most hands. Many hands are raised before the flop. I did see villain_1 involved in a hand that was capped preflop where he eventually showed down AJo out of position and took down the pot.

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+2: (Villain_1)/ calls, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, Button: (Villain_2)/ calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>.

Flop: (7.50 SB) 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, Villain_1 calls, Villain_2 calls.

Turn: (5.25 BB) Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, Villain_1 calls, Villain_2 calls.

River: (8.25 BB) K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Villain_1 raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Villain_2 3-bets</font>, Hero folds, Villain_1 calls.

Final Pot: 15.25 BB

So there you go. I know that in big pots you should be pretty sure you're beat to fold a made hand. Had villain_2 called Villain_1's raise instead of re-raising, I'd have certainly called for one more bet. But I was getting 7 to 1 odds to make a two-bet call. Are those enough odds to make a crying call here?

jackdaniels
02-23-2005, 12:33 PM
I can't see how you are still ahead over here. I think I would make this fold as well (defiently call for 1 more bet but the re-re-raise means someone has at least 2 pair and since the action isn't over yet, you may call just to find you need to call a cap from the original raiser).

Good fold.

spydog
02-23-2005, 12:35 PM
Pretty easy fold.

Fat Nicky
02-23-2005, 12:38 PM
As already said, this fold is fine.

rmarotti
02-23-2005, 01:23 PM
Good fold.

einbert
02-23-2005, 02:12 PM
This isn't a bad fold, especially if you have some sort of read on either villian as being passive. They're not doing all this crap on the river with just top pair and you never made aces up, so I think a laydown is appropriate. Nice hand.

onehandfold
02-23-2005, 03:39 PM
Is it wrong to attempt to check/call that river?

Runner Runner
02-23-2005, 04:10 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Is it wrong to attempt to check/call that river?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes I believe it is wrong. I think you should be value betting in this spot against most opponents, and also if the action goes check, bet, raise, now you may not comfortably fold because the raiser could be playing over-aggressively with just a king.

gaming_mouse
02-23-2005, 04:29 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Is it wrong to attempt to check/call that river?

[/ QUOTE ]

Very wrong.

Also, the fold was good. The only way you call that is with a read on the 3-bettor as a maniac.