My Grandmother, the FISH

[sonicblue]

So, my 93 year old grandmother is a fish. She taught me how to play poker when I was a little kid in the early 80's. She's always loved the game. According to my aunts and uncles, she has always ben a lousy poker player.
I've only played hold 'em with her in the last year, and she was very bad. She's mainly a 7 stud player.
Anyway, the reason I am making this post is that she plays every Thursday night, with basically the same group she's been playing with for about 20-25 years. They play table stakes, and they are all rich. None of them need the money.
Until about a year and a half ago, she was holding her own, but at this point she is getting used.
Now, this is like, her thing to do during the week. And she was already bad at it and has gotten worse over the past year and a half. Two weeks ago her marker was $1700, along with whatever she brought.
She is and always has been very stubborn. I have alerted her two surviving sons that this is going on, but she insists on playing. They've tried to get her to stop, but she knows everything, and is going senile at this point. She is a liar to boot, meaning it takes a few tries to see what she really lost the night before.
So she won't stop voluntarily, but my aunt had a pretty solid idea. My aunt was going to call the "regulars" and ask them to tell the grandmother that the game had broken up. Best course as far as I know. It's really tough to tell someone who survived the great depression and brought up four kids successfully how to do things later in life.
The fact is though, that she is a fish with a capital "F" and her game is taking advantage of her.
Has anyone here ever been in a situation like this? A friend or loved one who doesn't want to stop but just loses week after week? How to get a 93 year old dog to do a new trick like not play?

[Pepsquad]

I'm sorry, this really is not funny - yet I found myself smiling as I read your post. First off, where is this game and do they have room for one more? Second, how the hell do you play for 25 years and still be this god aweful? So everybody in the game is wealthy...is your grandmother wealthy? I guess my initial reaction is...after 93 years and 4 children, the lady has earned to right to do with her money as she pleases. If that means blowing some cash in the Thur. night poker game as an entertainment expense so be it. I mean, after over two decades of this and consistently losing money, your grandmother isn't deluded. She's obviously playing the game for reasons other than money. As long as she's not spewing grocery money, I say let her be.

Pep.

[pzhon]

Can you set up a different game for her with lower stakes, or give her something else to do?

[Zygote]

[ QUOTE ]
Second, how the hell do you play for 25 years and still be this god aweful?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you practice the wrong thing you only get good at doing the wrong thing.

[Zygote]

Very tough situation. I have three friends that individually throw away over 100k a year. I have spent hours and hours trying to tell them how they are doomed to lose and nothing works. They have been to GA, but that did nothing. I mean one of my friends was at my house and he spent the day going through a few of my casino books trying to learn why i alwasy say that baccarat is unbeatable. After reading a few books i found out he spent his afternoon dropping a couple K at baccarat. I've kind of realized nothing i say or do will help so i guess they'll have to figure it out on their own. I do'nt have any answers, but you should at least try explaining to her some fundamental gambling theories. Past that i got no ideas, but please let me know if you figure something out.

[the_joker]

Is the money she's losing significant to her? If not, I'd say don't worry about it. It may be one of the only fun things in life left for her. You might as well go out doing the things you enjoy. If the money is significant and you think she's being taken advantage of then I think your intervention plan is good.

[revots33]

My 91-year old grandmother loves to play scratch-off lottery tickets. She's lost a bundle over the years I'm sure, but she enjoys it, and I'm not about to lecture her on odds or probabilities. I figure she's earned the right to have her fun and spend her money however.

At 93 I doubt your grandma is looking to join the WPT. I'm sure it is a social outlet, and I assume she enjoys it. I'd think she might be sad if you break up the game.

Unless she is gambling away money she can't afford to lose, I say let her have her fun and back off.

When I'm 93 (and an even worse poker player than I already am), I hope no one starts telling me I can't play anymore because I'm lousy at it.

[maldini]

can you convince the house (whomever that is) to cease extending credit to your mammy? that would be step one.

is it at all convenient for you to insist on playing one night just to see if she's completely out of it? you could prolly make that very fun for yourself.

also, i dont care how affluent she is, $1700/week is bad news for anyone.

[Blackjack]

If this is real and the opponents don't care about the money, then I think your plan of action is solid.

However, if the opponents are lining up funds for a new condo in Palm Springs - You are screwed.

Blackjack

[sonicblue]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm sorry, this really is not funny - yet I found myself smiling as I read your post. First off, where is this game and do they have room for one more?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's sad, but it is funny. My uncle wrote in an email, "...she's a gamemaker. If she were in my game I'd send a limo every week to pick her up." I got a kick out of that.

This is a social outlet, but if she doesn't tone it down the money will start becoming significant. A couple years ago she might've had one winning session in four on average, with an occasional hot month. I don't think she's won more than five out of the last fifty sessions.
I don't want to stop her from having fun, but she doesn't seem to be able to say, "OK, if I dump 8 bills I quit for the night".

[ QUOTE ]
First off, where is this game and do they have room for one more?

[/ QUOTE ]

I knew someone would ask this LOL. The game happens in Hawthorne NJ. My grandmother the consistent loser says there's a certifiable maniac in the game as well. I think the only way she wins is taking this guy out.

[ QUOTE ]
can you convince the house (whomever that is) to cease extending credit to your mammy? that would be step one.

is it at all convenient for you to insist on playing one night just to see if she's completely out of it? you could prolly make that very fun for yourself.

also, i dont care how affluent she is, $1700/week is bad news for anyone.


[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I think I'm going to have a quick sit-down with her ride tomorrow night and tell him no more markers or I will have to take action. They've actually ivited me to sit in on the games, but in addition to draw, 7-stud, and hold 'em they play games like chase and tri-y, so I declined.
My trump card is that she is living in my house, and loves it here, so that gives some serious leverage.
I feel pretty weird posting personal family matters like this, but I figured there might be some here who've dealt with a similar situation. Thanks everyone for the responses, I appreciate it.

[Michael Davis]

Obviously your grandmother's competition is too tough. Tell her to try Party Poker.

-Michael

[Reef]

[ QUOTE ]
As long as she's not spewing grocery money, I say let her be.



[/ QUOTE ]

let her enjoy the last few years she might have left

[Bremen]

[ QUOTE ]
Obviously your grandmother's competition is too tough. Tell her to try Party Poker.


[/ QUOTE ]
Which is worse, dumping $1700 once a week or the ability to dump a couple bucks an hour for as long as you care? Mind you the real danger is if she's used to dumping a dime or more a night she may do the same thing every night online.

Um, I just thought, that was a joke wasn't it...

[Bluffoon]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm sorry, this really is not funny - yet I found myself smiling as I read your post. First off, where is this game and do they have room for one more? Second, how the hell do you play for 25 years and still be this god aweful? So everybody in the game is wealthy...is your grandmother wealthy? I guess my initial reaction is...after 93 years and 4 children, the lady has earned to right to do with her money as she pleases. If that means blowing some cash in the Thur. night poker game as an entertainment expense so be it. I mean, after over two decades of this and consistently losing money, your grandmother isn't deluded. She's obviously playing the game for reasons other than money. As long as she's not spewing grocery money, I say let her be.

Pep.

[/ QUOTE ]

What the hell else are you going to do for fun at 93? God bless her and lady, have fun blowing it all. You can't take it with you.

[QuadsOverQuads]

I'm unclear here on the amounts involved. Is $1700 her *total* debt, or is that just for that one week?


q/q

[Reef]

[ QUOTE ]

I'm unclear here on the amounts involved. Is $1700 her *total* debt, or is that just for that one week?


q/q

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm thinking more towards the week

[sonicblue]

That was one week. She plays one night a week, and that was one night's/week's losses.

[Bacchus]

In general, I'm of the opinion live and let live. And maybe 1700 is not a lot to her, but it probably is a lot to someone else. Before I did anything, I'd double check her competition. Are you sure that ALL of the other players are her "friends" who have been playing forever? If they have invited you to play, how do you know who else is there? Perhaps someone else is taking advantage of her.

[dogmeat]

That is a tough problem. Good luck to you. My own feeling is that she plays for the joy of seeing her friends and the entertainment. I would hate to see you take that away from her. Since she lives with you, how is the money going to be a problem?

Is this money she could be leaving to somebody in a will? Is that the major problem? What other activities does she have?

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but come on. She's 93. What else does she have going during the week?

Dogmeat /images/graemlins/spade.gif

[Dave H.]

Unless she was squandering money she needs OR MY INHERITANCE (in reverse order!), I say let her enjoy herself.

[kutuz_off]

Obviously, she doesn't care for money and plays for social interaction. She probably feels she needs to play virtually every hand to be part of the group. She might also feel like raising hands is "unfriendly". So instead of telling her not to play, you might try to make her a better player. Tighter/more aggressive, AKA "less friendly". She won't be a winner, but she'll lose a lot less.

You said that she knows another maniac at the game, which means she hasnt totally lost her senses. She still observes the game, right? Maybe she can improve.

Another thing is that 1700$ can buy a week on a poker cruise ship (right?). Try sending her there to show the comparative value of losing that much money in one night.

[BUD]

How ironic, a bunch of poker sharks trying to figure out how to protect the fish. This is hilarious! How about starting up a new game yourself, and or taking her to some casino's. If she is with you, i would think you could control the loses or help her improve. Maybe her friends would agree to add another poker night at your place. I do not know the whole story, but if it is your inheritance it could be very +ev. Or at the very least you could be the one getting the money @ the table.
seriously
bud

[Wally Weeks]

[ QUOTE ]
Obviously, she doesn't care for money and plays for social interaction. She probably feels she needs to play virtually every hand to be part of the group. She might also feel like raising hands is "unfriendly". So instead of telling her not to play, you might try to make her a better player. Tighter/more aggressive, AKA "less friendly". She won't be a winner, but she'll lose a lot less.

You said that she knows another maniac at the game, which means she hasnt totally lost her senses. She still observes the game, right? Maybe she can improve.

Another thing is that 1700$ can buy a week on a poker cruise ship (right?). Try sending her there to show the comparative value of losing that much money in one night.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a good idea and especially so if you've been meaning to spend some more time with her. If she's not suffering from dementia too much, you can bring some of your basic strategy book over and buy her lunch some day. Basic starting hand requirements might be good enough to stop much of the losses.

On a similar, but less dramatic note, my girl friend's grandmother likes to partake in spending money on lunches and dinners. She'll practically take anyone out to lunch or dinner for the social aspects. While this doesn't sound like much, it can add up pretty quick, especially for someone that doesn't have very much money or make any money. My girl friend's father has told me she has spent money from her life savings to do this. Oftentimes she'll go out to lunch and dinner paying for 4, 5, or more meals a day plus tips. This is somewhat sad since her husband worked so hard to save that money after dying from work-related (and smoking) problems at the Seattle Fire Department.

Personally, since it's not my family (as of yet) I don't feel like I have any say. And besides, I agree with the live and let live motto. At worst we can all share the expense a little.

Regards,
Walter