live at the bike, 400-800 with ted forrest

[TStoneMBD]

400-800 at the bike.

http://www.thebike.com/live_at_the_bike/index.php
streaming video of live cash games at the bike. takes place at nighttimes.

hole card cam:
ted shows 92o
bus shows KQo
chad shows AA

jerry bus, the owner of the la lakers is in the BB. the game is ridiculous. i means RIDICULOUS. its out of control. there has been a flop every hand for the last 20 hands.

ted forrest raises UTG2, chad brown 3bets from the CO, jerry bus calls in the BB, forrest calls.

flop: K82r
2 checks, chad bets, call call.

turn: 2
bus checks, ted bets, chad raises allin, bus calls, ted 3bets, bus calls.

river:J
bus checks, ted bets, bus calls.


the question i have concerning this hand is this; why did forrest raise it in with this garbage? i understand that maybe its important to be deceptive now and then, and that you need to give action to get action, but in a game where it is simply impossible to steal the blinds with a raise, isnt this just a fish play? are plays like this somewhat common at stakes this high? id like to emphasize that there were few pros at the table. most players were rich fish. the only players at the table were tuan le, toto, forrest, and brown. friedmen joined later, who apparently is a regular there and played well.

be sure to mention if there is an interest in these types of hands from the bike. ill be sure to post the ones i view on a regular basis if there is.

[esspo]

You said they were seeing a lot of flops, but were they also seeing a lot of rivers? If not, then a player like Forrest who is supposed to be great at reading hands and players might be able to make this work for him as long as he doesn't do it so often that it becomes correct to always call him down with A-hi. You never know though, he might have been on tilt or hadn't played a hand for two hours and got frustrated.

[mmcd]

misclick.

[random@cash]

That is pretty wild, even for Ted. Who knows what these guys are thinking !?!? Obviously he got lucky. I can only assume that not many hands go to showdown and that naked (calculated?) aggression wins at this level more often than big cards. Nothing groundbreaking but still cool to see.

[TStoneMBD]

i dont know, i gotta say that the action was ridiculously wild. people were calling to the river with any piece of the board or any ace.

[na4bart]

I also watched this game. Watched for an hour and a half just to be sure I wasn't seeing things. Worst collection of holdem players I've seen in awhile. If this wasn't just stage play then this 20/40 player can beat that game. Oh for the bankroll!

[geormiet]

Maybe he was just blowing off steam? Isn't 400/800 small stakes for him?

[SCfuji]

the guy is a GAMBLER. a true GAMBLER. did you guys watch one of the first season WPT episodes with ted at the final table? it may have been the second season, but they asked him what the craziest bet he ever took in his life... his answer was running a marathon in vegas in something around 105 degree heat. he said the souls of his feet melted off and stuck to his shoe. i think raising 92o utg is quite the norm for this man.

[DeezNutz3]

I like the Bike hand TStoneMBD, keep em' coming!

[lil feller]

[ QUOTE ]
be sure to mention if there is an interest in these types of hands from the bike. ill be sure to post the ones i view on a regular basis if there is.

[/ QUOTE ]

While I certainly enjoy reading them, I'm not sure if there is much to be gained from them, strategically speaking. One of the most important factor when discussing a hand is the emotion and logic behind the decisions made by people with known hole cards. We can't possibly know why they are doing what they are doing, which makes it much more difficult to analyze. Practicing our analytical skills based on unknown emotions could be valuable in itself however...

lf

[felson]

[ QUOTE ]
While I certainly enjoy reading them, I'm not sure if there is much to be gained from them, strategically speaking.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah, screw it. Post 'em anyway.

[bobbyi]

[ QUOTE ]
be sure to mention if there is an interest in these types of hands from the bike. ill be sure to post the ones i view on a regular basis if there is.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'd have a real interest in hands you catch with interesting strategic content/ decisions, but not so much in lots of hands that are simply wild and crazy (although posting one of those was cool).

[Boris]

[ QUOTE ]
why did forrest raise it in with this garbage?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because he is on camera. He is inviting you to join his game.

[Rick Nebiolo]

Threads regarding "Live at Bike" are cropping up all over 2+2. Here is a link (http://tinyurl.com/4ol5d) to a long thread on the TV forum regarding this particular game (obviously, a lot of talk concerned this hand).

I'm not sure that the "Live at Bike" will feature a huge limit holdem game this Thursday. The regular big game players prefer mix games, and this doesn't work well with the hole card cams. When they do have limit holdem I'll try (with Mason's permission) to post information in an appropriate forum.

Regards,

Rick

[youngin20]

i think a few people have said that ted is a bad hold 'em player. i think that means that he is bad for his calibur, he is a stud specialist, and apparently an amazing one at that, and so, i think he is a big stud player where ante steals are important.

[AlwaysWrong]

Ok, the theory that it's just bad / he doesn't care / whatever has merit, but assuming it's not just awful, here's my theory:

This is obviously a great game. He wants to keep the action fast and furious, he wants people calling all the way to the river with A-high. He also knows that his opponents often won't make him pay for his poor preflop hand selection. So his goal in this hand is to flip over his 92o and show people that he could literally play any two cards.

[Usagi_yo]

Looks like Chad got lucky that somebody with 92o raised his pocket AA, then got unlucky when they made trips.

Jerry Bus, like usual subsidizes the nose-bleed limit players. He should just put them on his payroll as assistant coaches or something.

[Usagi_yo]

I think its BS. If a young no-name kid jumped in this game and did that you would laugh and call him a fish. The fact to me looks like Jerry Bus shouldn't be playing in this game.

[FeliciaLee]

[ QUOTE ]
i think a few people have said that ted is a bad hold 'em player. i think that means that he is bad for his calibur, he is a stud specialist, and apparently an amazing one at that, and so, i think he is a big stud player where ante steals are important.

[/ QUOTE ]
I have heard this, too. He is certainly a lot looser in HE than any other game I've seen him play! He does play hands that he claims show a profit over a long run, even in Stud games, but for the most part, he is very tight.

Barry (http://www.barrygreenstein.com/tforrest.htm) has this to say about him:

No-limit: 4
(a rating of 1-10)

"Ted is a very tricky player and is known for making great reads."

From playing against Ted, talking with him, and watching him play, I would say this is very consistent.

Felicia /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[FeliciaLee]

It is hard to believe that southern CA games are as loose and wild as they are, but it is true.

I was simply amazed when I played there the past two times. It was something I would have never believed, had I not witnessed it myself.

Someone like Ted is extremely good at adapting to his surroundings. I have seen him play like this before, this almost maniacal, crazy style. I have also seen him fold, fold, fold like a rock, and have to dust off his chips every few hours, lol.

His ability to adapt quickly and easily, without losing control or tilting is part of what makes him a WCP. It seems ludicrious to watch, but I'm pretty sure he knows what he's doing, and not just blowing away money for the show.

Felicia /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Your Mom]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i think a few people have said that ted is a bad hold 'em player. i think that means that he is bad for his calibur, he is a stud specialist, and apparently an amazing one at that, and so, i think he is a big stud player where ante steals are important.

[/ QUOTE ]
I have heard this, too. He is certainly a lot looser in HE than any other game I've seen him play! He does play hands that he claims show a profit over a long run, even in Stud games, but for the most part, he is very tight.

Barry (http://www.barrygreenstein.com/tforrest.htm) has this to say about him:

No-limit: 4
(a rating of 1-10)

"Ted is a very tricky player and is known for making great reads."

From playing against Ted, talking with him, and watching him play, I would say this is very consistent.

Felicia /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Is there somewhere you can see Barry's rankings of players?

[AceHigh]

barry g's player analysis (http://www.barrygreenstein.com/analysis.htm)

[DcifrThs]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i think a few people have said that ted is a bad hold 'em player. i think that means that he is bad for his calibur, he is a stud specialist, and apparently an amazing one at that, and so, i think he is a big stud player where ante steals are important.

[/ QUOTE ]
I have heard this, too. He is certainly a lot looser in HE than any other game I've seen him play! He does play hands that he claims show a profit over a long run, even in Stud games, but for the most part, he is very tight.

Barry (http://www.barrygreenstein.com/tforrest.htm) has this to say about him:

No-limit: 4
(a rating of 1-10)

"Ted is a very tricky player and is known for making great reads."

From playing against Ted, talking with him, and watching him play, I would say this is very consistent.

Felicia /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

so is barry as good as he rates himself?? he places himself one notch above ted forrest in side games...and says he's tighter and less aggressive than forrest...

is he truly that good?

-Barron

[FeliciaLee]

[ QUOTE ]
so is barry as good as he rates himself?? he places himself one notch above ted forrest in side games...and says he's tighter and less aggressive than forrest...

is he truly that good?

[/ QUOTE ]
I've only played against Barry in tourneys, not cash games (don't I wish I was that good). Barry says that I am an above average tourney player, but still very much a beginner. /images/graemlins/blush.gif So I have a long way to go before I can say just how good Barry is.

Based on what I have heard about him from others, I would say that he is as good as he says he is. I have never heard others say that he is less successful than he claims. If someone were to make a false claim like that in poker, everyone would pounce in a minute (think Hellmuth and all of his claims).

I think Barry is simply being honest. No one has ever proven otherwise.

Felicia /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[DcifrThs]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
so is barry as good as he rates himself?? he places himself one notch above ted forrest in side games...and says he's tighter and less aggressive than forrest...

is he truly that good?

[/ QUOTE ]
I've only played against Barry in tourneys, not cash games (don't I wish I was that good). Barry says that I am an above average tourney player, but still very much a beginner. /images/graemlins/blush.gif So I have a long way to go before I can say just how good Barry is.

Based on what I have heard about him from others, I would say that he is as good as he says he is. I have never heard others say that he is less successful than he claims. If someone were to make a false claim like that in poker, everyone would pounce in a minute (think Hellmuth and all of his claims).

I think Barry is simply being honest. No one has ever proven otherwise.

Felicia /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

well in that case...i'd pay for his high limit holdem book if he ever gets it out...can you letme know when that happens?

-Barron

[Rick Nebiolo]

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe he was just blowing off steam? Isn't 400/800 small stakes for him?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ted often plays in the very big game at Hustler with Larry Flynt - more like 4000/8000 (and if Larry plays my understanding is that the game is stud, Ted'd best game).

~ Rick

[Rick Nebiolo]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure that the "Live at Bike" will feature a huge limit holdem game this Thursday. The regular big game players prefer mix games, and this doesn't work well with the hole card cams. When they do have limit holdem I'll try (with Mason's permission) to post information in an appropriate forum.

[/ QUOTE ]

Last night I learned that "Live at Bike" will feature another big holdem (probably 400/800) game on Thursday, Febuary 25th. If I hear about any changes or updates, I'll try to post it.

~ Rick