Beating the rake: Rules of thumb

[mdlm]

In Intelligent Gambler (issue Number 9) Lou Krieger in an article titled "Beating Low Limit Games" suggests that 3/6 and 4/8 B&M games may not be beatable once rake, toke, and jackpot drop are taken into account.

Expressed as a percentage of the BB, what is the maximum rake that a player should accept? In the example that Krieger gives, there is a $3 max rake per hand, a $1 toke per hand, and a $1 jackpot drop per hand. So this suggests that a total rake of 70% of the BB is too tough to beat.

I am particularly interested in analysis of the Mohegan Sun 3/6 game. In this game, I believe that there is a $2 rake at the flop, a $1 rake at the river if the pot is at least $30 and a $2 rake at the river if the pot is at least $50. Is this beatable? Does anyone know what the typical toke is in this game?

Are there any articles or books that discuss this?

Thx.

(Incidentally, isn't a $1/hand toke at 3/6 outrageous? That means that the dealer is making $30/hr on top of salary??!!)

[Mason Malmuth]

I disagree completely. I have yet to see a low limit game that I didn't think was beatable. However, with this being said there are very few players doing it because they usually quickly move to a higher game. But if your opponents play badly, which is almost always the case in these low limit high rake games, they are definitely beatable.

[Andy B]

I used to play in a $2/4 stud game with a $.50 ante and a $1 bring-in. The game is raked at 10%, capped at $4.50, and there is a $1 jackpot drop. I would tip $1. I beat the game for about $7/hr. The players were just horrible. A high rake does not necessarily make a game unbeatable. Just make sure you're a lot better than everyone else in the game. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

I don't know what dealers make, but they're not making the killing you imagine them to. I've never been to Mohegan Sun, but I did play some $5/10 stud at Foxwoods last year, and everybody tipped $.50. Dealers are generally paid something close to minimum wage, plus tips. Some rooms pool tips; some don't. Dealers generally have to take several long breaks during their shifts, so they don't get any tips during that time. During the wee hours of the morning at my local room, a dealer might deal one table for half an hour, break for half an hour, deal another table, etc. They ain't makin' $30/hr.

[Louie Landale]

At the mid limits a typical good player will make about 1BB/hour (including tip/rake) against reasonably tough opponents. Why some people insist the low limits that may feature a %75 BB drop is unbeatable is beyond my comprehention; especially since the opponents play terribly.

- Louie

[Vehn]

A friend of mine has been beating the $2/$4 hold'em at Canterbury Park with a $4 rake + $1 JP drop + toke consistently for almost a year. Its possible.

I play in Lake Charles where the rake is $5 max with a $1 jackpot drop in a $3-6-12 spread game.

Talk about a crappy rake - and I've been able to beat that every time I've been down there. Granted, it's a lot of pure grinding - but it's beatable.

dealers making 30$ an hour! where do i sign up? just kiding folks. I'am a dealer, in most low limit games people generally tip 50 cents. Which i do appreciate, think at the end of the day it adds up. Now you said you tip one dollar, I think thats great. Espesially in the smaller games. But lets not forget the ones who dont tip at all. Even if they win a 1000$ pot playin 20-40. after 2 years of dealing i now make 5.05 an hour. we split our tips at the casino i work for and it comes out to be about 16 an hour. now add up the times i get sent home because were slow or sick days ect... it comes out to about 40k a year.