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View Full Version : Confused - stealing with 12-15x BB stack in MTT's


otctrader
02-20-2005, 09:05 AM
General theory question; we're mid-tourney, low buyin, large inexperienced field, but some of the trash has been weeded out. Blinds 200/400, I'm CO-1 and pick up AQs with T5000, have blinds covered, folded to me. I make my standard openraise to T1200, button calls (has me covered but not by much), blinds fold. Assume button was moved to your table an orbit ago, you have no reads.

Flop (T3000): K rag rag, rainbow

Here's where I'm confused; T3000 in the pot, I've got T3800 left, and put button on low pockets. Couple of questions -

1) What kind of bet should I fire off here? Earlier in the tourney or with a much larger stack I think nothing of making my standard 2/3 pot bet; this, however, leaves me with a lame 4xBB, or 6xBB if I 1/2 pot it. Does anyone modify this 1/2-3/4 pot guideline later in the tourney, or is this just an invitation for the button to smell weakness and come over the top? Anyone check this or push instead?

2) Assume I put button on low pockets or ace rag (possible at these buyins). I 2/3 pot it to represent AK or high pockets, leaving me with T1800. Button pushes, $hit. Either he's got a king, or he's a real smooth operator...

a) My inclination is to run for the hills with my crippled 4xBB stack since I only give myself 2 clean ace outs. Here's the problem; blinds go to 300/600 and I'll be forced to shove something between now and UTG, and at low buyins the table cops LOVE to pick off UTGish desperation pushes.

b) Anyone make a crying call here being pot committed hoping he's either bluffing with ace high or has something like TT?

This situation comes up quite often in the 10-20xBB stack range and really makes me think twice about steals since anything respectable that I fire on the flop cripples my stack. Thanks for any help.

betgo
02-20-2005, 10:00 AM
With 3000 in the pot and 3800 left, I would just push and hope your opponent doesn't have a K or decent pp, or if he does maybe you can hit one of your outs. If you bet 2000 and your opponent pushes, you really have to call, so just push.

Preflop I would consider pushing here. If you don't push, I like a miniraise so as not to be as pot committed. By making either of these moves, you avoid the uncomfortable situation you got into on the flop.

Elaboration
02-20-2005, 02:36 PM
Push, or check fold on the flop. If he has a king you're toast. If he has a mid pair then that would be one hell of a call. Most would fold, but even if he calls you still have your outs.
Any bet pot commits you. Having to call a raise here, or considering folding to a raise (which you can't) will give you a sick feeling in the pit of your stomach.

Regards,
E

Potowame
02-20-2005, 02:53 PM
This is a tricky spot from the get go with shallow stacks, its really close to a push preflop, a mini raise or limp is not out of the question. I really dont like the raise for 3-4 bbs here because it makes post flop play , to hard.

How you played it you pretty well have to call and hope for the best...