Newbie Hand #1 - QQ UTG

[dfscott]

I trying to learn NL SnGs (11's). I wasn't sure what to do here. Is this too weak or is it safest to fold this early? In retrospect, I'm thinking I probably should've bet 200 on the flop and folded to a raise. By checking, I'm not sure if he's bluffing or if he's betting small and hoping I'll call.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t50 (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

BB (t1575)
Hero (t755)
UTG+1 (t825)
MP1 (t755)
MP2 (t1145)
MP3 (t655)
CO (t1060)
Button (t665)
SB (t565)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t200</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, MP3 calls t200, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>.

Flop: (t475) A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 bets t100</font>, Hero folds.

Final Pot: t575

[AtticusFinch]

[ QUOTE ]
By checking, I'm not sure if he's bluffing or if he's betting small and hoping I'll call.

[/ QUOTE ]

For starters your preflop raise is fine. I also think it's fine to check in front. In 11s, where people will play any ace, it's the prudent thing to do with an ace on board.

As you say, the wussy bet from villain usually signifies either a huge hand trying to suck some chips out of you, or a lame attempt at a bluff. The latter is far more common, especially at the 11s.

I personally would consider making him fess up by putting in a hefty raise here. If he reraises, you can fold. If he calls, who knows, a queen may fall, or you may pick up a flush draw.

[ChrisV]

Waaaaay too weak. The pot is 475 and your stack is 555. The sad truth is you're going to find it pretty difficult to get away from this hand. You don't have any way to find out what your opponent has without committing yourself.

There are actually only a few likely ace hands - AT, AJ and maybe AQ. AK generally reraises and the others generally fold. Contrast this with the possible hands you're beating - KQ, KJ, TT, 99, 88, 77, 66 are all quite likely.

I think it's slightly more likely you're ahead than behind on this flop, and the pot is pretty big so you simply have to commit. The only reason I would check here is if I thought my opponent was aggressive enough to bluff at it with a hand worse than mine. I would have check raised that 100 and I think its very likely he would have folded.

Edit: Just noticed MP3 has only 455 left. That makes it even more clearcut - there's no way you're folding this hand. I would check because MP3 is quite likely to desperation-bluff the rest of his stack.

[AtticusFinch]

[ QUOTE ]
Waaaaay too weak. The pot is 475 and your stack is 555. The sad truth is you're going to find it pretty difficult to get away from this hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Silly me, I switched his stack with another player's. Now it's even more clear. You have to attack here.

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
Waaaaay too weak. The pot is 475 and your stack is 555. The sad truth is you're going to find it pretty difficult to get away from this hand. You don't have any way to find out what your opponent has without committing yourself.

There are actually only a few likely ace hands - AT, AJ and maybe AQ. AK generally reraises and the others generally fold. Contrast this with the possible hands you're beating - KQ, KJ, TT, 99, 88, 77, 66 are all quite likely.

I think it's slightly more likely you're ahead than behind on this flop, and the pot is pretty big so you simply have to commit. The only reason I would check here is if I thought my opponent was aggressive enough to bluff at it with a hand worse than mine. I would have check raised that 100 and I think its very likely he would have folded.

Edit: Just noticed MP3 has only 455 left. That makes it even more clearcut - there's no way you're folding this hand. I would check because MP3 is quite likely to desperation-bluff the rest of his stack.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hmm. Really?
I guess I may be leaking in spots like this.

[Allinlife]

by the way, I think he raised too much with Queens out of position, I'd usually do 70'ish to try to keep it short

[ChrisV]

Look at it this way. Your equity in the allin pot if he has, say, A /images/graemlins/club.gifT /images/graemlins/club.gif is .141, which is 195 chips. So if you move in and you're wrong your loss is 260 chips. If you get him allin with 9 /images/graemlins/club.gif9 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif your win compared to folding is 815 chips - over three times as much. If he folds without putting any more chips in the pot, your win is 475 - still nearly twice as much. This means that you have to think the probability of him not having an ace is somewhere between 1 in 3 and 1 in 4, before you break even check-folding. I don't think him not having an ace (or set) is anywhere near that unlikely.

You have no means of getting any information about your opponent's hand. Any bet pot commits you and if you check, a bet from him implies nothing except that he'd like to win the pot. There are some opponents who will always check behind here without an ace but I don't think you can rely on that at all.

Given all that, you're allin... when he has an ace, you're toast, so the problem becomes one of how you can extract chips when he has no ace. That will make the required probability of him not having an ace, for you to profit, lower. So check and let him hang himself.