AK gets resistance pf [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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me454555

02-13-2005, 02:11 PM

All 3 of these hands are pretty similar so I decided to post em all together. I'm having a problem playing AK when I get 3 bet or capped pf. I never know how many outs I have here b/c I'm worried about being dominated.

Hand 1

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
Hero raises, 1 fold, UTG+2 3-bets, 7 folds, Hero calls.

Flop: (7.33 SB) 7/images/graemlins/club.gif, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+2 bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.66 BB) 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+2 bets, Hero calls.

River: (6.66 BB) 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+2 bets, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 7.66 BB

Hand 2

Even though the pot was big, I tossed the turn b/c I was getting 10:1 and I figured I had 2 outs at best.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is CO with K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
3 folds, MP2 raises, Hero 3-bets, Button caps, 1 fold, BB calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (16.40 SB) 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (4 players)
BB checks, MP2 checks, Hero checks, Button bets, BB calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (10.20 BB) 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (4 players)
BB checks, MP2 checks, Hero checks, Button bets, BB calls, MP2 folds, Hero folds.

River: (12.20 BB) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
BB bets, Button raises, BB folds.

Final Pot: 15.20 BB

Hand 3

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
2 folds, Hero raises, MP1 calls, 4 folds, SB 3-bets, 1 fold, Hero caps, MP1 calls, SB calls.

Flop: (13 SB) J/images/graemlins/spade.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players)
SB bets, Hero calls, MP1 folds.

Turn: (7.50 BB) 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

River: (9.50 BB) 5/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
SB bets, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 10.50 BB

Milky

02-13-2005, 02:17 PM

It looks to me like you may be taking your overcard hands too far.

Hand 1 I fold on the flop. What are you drawing to that will win on this board vs. these opponents?

Hand 2 I play the same way.

Hand 3 I might raise the flop depending on the player. Otherwise I can fold the turn UI. What are you calling there for?

me454555

02-13-2005, 02:35 PM

Hand 1: I think your right, I should probobly fold the turn there
Hand 3: The pot is laying me 8.5:1 to call. I didn't think he had the flush and I figured him for a pp w/or w/out a spade. I gave myself for 5 outs here so I called the turn and tossed the river unimproved.

Milky

02-13-2005, 02:53 PM

Hand 1 I said fold on flop, not turn /images/graemlins/wink.gif

Hand 3, I don't think you have 5 full outs. What is SB 3-betting a UTG raiser and caller with? Unless you have a read of course, he's 3-betting JJ-AA (and sometimes not even jacks) and AK here. So even if you hit a K or A you're only at best chopping the pot and at worst are going to lose more money.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong though.

me454555

02-13-2005, 03:05 PM

Hand 1: You can't fold on the flop here. I'm getting 8.5:1 and I can be drawing very live to as much as 6 outs. Again, my read is that my opponent has a big pair or overcards w/or w/out a flush draw. I may actually have the best hand on the flop and my opponent will bet the flop no matter what. I think folding the turn is correct though.

Hand 3: Sb 3 bet pf, so he has a big pair (TT-AA), AK or AQ. He'd bet the flop regardless of his holding b/c of the board. I feel that he's less likely to hold AA or KK b/c I hold 1 or each. He's also not likely to hold JJ so that narrows his range of hands down. The pot is definatly big enough for me to call the flop.

If he's got QQ or TT (his 2 most likely holdings), I have 5 outs which makes this a good call. If he's got AK I'm splitting the pot and have too much pot equity to fold. If he's got KK, I have still have 2.5 outs and if he's got AA, I'm screwed. OTOH, if he's got AQ folding the winner would be disasterous unless he's got AQ of spades.

Adding all that together and given the pot size, I think I have enough here to warrent a call given that his most likely hands are QQ, TT, and AK.

TheMetetron

02-13-2005, 03:21 PM

I'm going to agree with milk here. Everywhere he said to fold was correct. I also consider capping pre-flop hand 1, depending on read.

Edit: Actually this all brings up an important point. All of this stuff is READ dependent. Get PT/Playerview if you don't already have it. Makes these decisions much easier.

Entity

02-13-2005, 03:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: You can't fold on the flop here. I'm getting 8.5:1 and I can be drawing very live to as much as 6 outs. Again, my read is that my opponent has a big pair or overcards w/or w/out a flush draw. I may actually have the best hand on the flop and my opponent will bet the flop no matter what. I think folding the turn is correct though.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think this is correct. It's very unlikely you have the best hand after the flop unless your opponent is someone who will frequently 3-bet you with AJ, AQ, etc. You're drawing to 6 outs only if he has noncrub Q's, noncrub J's, noncrub T's, etc, which weights your odds down overall -- a good portion of the time you have 4 or occasionally 6 outs here, but some of the time you'll have 0 outs or 2 outs, which probably weights your hand to around 3-4 outs overall, which isn't enough to call this flop bet.