QQ and JJ

[cold_cash]

I'm going to post two hands here, even though I hate posts w/ multiple hands, because these were similar hands against the same opponent.

My opponent here was pretty much ideal. He saw about 50% of all flops, and only raised pre-flop about 4% of the time. His average aggession rating was about 1. (Although on the river it skyrocketed to a little over 5.) I had about 150 hands w/ him.

Hand Uno

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, Q/images/graemlins/club.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">5 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (6 SB) 7/images/graemlins/club.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB folds, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (4 BB) J/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">UTG+1 raises</font>, Hero calls.

River: (8 BB) 5/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG+1 bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 10 BB

----------------------------------------------------

Hand 2

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is CO with J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB calls, BB calls, MP1 calls.

Flop: (8 SB) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif, T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, BB folds, MP1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, SB calls, MP1 folds.

Turn: (6.50 BB) 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (8.50 BB) 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 10.50 BB

It seems that lately I've been taking a "here's some rope, go ahead and hang yourself" approach, and I feel like I'm missing bets and/or playing too fancy.

I dunno.

[adamstewart]

[ QUOTE ]
I hate posts w/ multiple hands

[/ QUOTE ]

Me too /images/graemlins/wink.gif


Adam

[adamstewart]

HAND #1: It's probably "correct" to fold this to the turn raise. (Although I'd have a tough time doing it in the heat of a hand - Is that really an excuse /images/graemlins/confused.gif /images/graemlins/wink.gif).


HAND #2: I play it the same way. You're either ahead, or waaaaayyyy behind. For those times that you're ahead, let him hang himself. Call it down to the finish line.


Adam

[SmileyEH]

looks fine to me. The high river aggression just means he chases.

-SmileyEH

[pyroponic]

Hand #2:

Why not raise on the turn and see if he 3-bets, if he just calls the raise he'll proably check to you on the river.

[cold_cash]

[ QUOTE ]
Hand #2:

Why not raise on the turn and see if he 3-bets, if he just calls the raise he'll proably check to you on the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

It doesn't seem like I could call down if he 3-bets, so if I'm going to spend two bets with a raise/fold I might as well spend those same two with a call/call and see a showdown.

Also I don't want him to stop betting or fold a hand I'm beating.

[adamstewart]

[ QUOTE ]
Hand #2:

Why not raise on the turn and see if he 3-bets

[/ QUOTE ]


Bad.


Adam

[detruncate]

Hand 1: I assume his post-flop aggression is skewed because of the river number. An aggression factor of 1 in a 50% player combined with tendency to raise (presumably) more than monster pairs PF usually makes me start to wonder if I can profitably call this down. His river aggression might argue somewhat in favour of this as well, but it's not nearly as helpful -- he's probably supplementing his big hands by picking up a lot of pots when checked to with a pair or some such.

It's not so much the numbers, but the psychology behind the numbers. A demonstration of aggression in less than ultra-obvious situations indicates a tendency to put himself out there a little more that you'd expect from a calling station. Even just raising some hands PF shows something. I'm not sure it adds up to a call down in this case, but I wouldn't be totally surprised if this guy took a pop at you with jacks-up or some other 2-pair.

I don't mind a fold here. It's not clear that you'd be gaining enough the times he's bluffing to make up for having to pay off all the legit raises.

I hate these situations, and feel like I swing between folding too much and paying off too much.

***

Hand 2: The stop and go from a passive player usually indicates a strong hand, and I think you took the best line if you're going to show down. If he's bluffing, let him bluff. A more aggressive line seems totally counter-productive -- it's likely that we need to maximize our profit when he's bluffing to make this even close to +EV.

I'd probably fold this. If Villain tabled 2-pair in Hand 1 it would help me make this call.

[suspicious_mind]

Hand1: I might check-call the turn and river sometimes in situations like these when I´m not sure what to do if I´m raised.

Hand2: I play it the same. If MP1 calls again I´d be worried though. If it was folded to me I might just call down.