View Full Version : Who raises AJ and KQ UTG
pokerjunky
02-12-2005, 11:50 PM
I know this has been debated plenty of times but I'm just curious as to what the general consensus is.
shadow29
02-12-2005, 11:51 PM
I don't think it's going to be close. raise pf.
pokerjunky
02-13-2005, 12:00 AM
Yea, I used to not do it but have starting doing so lately and am pleased with the results.
PhatPots
02-13-2005, 03:27 AM
I would raise unless the table circumstances dictate otherwise. If the table was loose/aggressive, I would fold it. I don't want to put in 3 bets prf w/ either of those hands
Cheers,
Pots
BottlesOf
02-13-2005, 03:47 AM
Who doesn't?
pyroponic
02-13-2005, 04:03 AM
I'm starting to just limp in EP and im getting good results.
Jake (The Snake)
02-13-2005, 04:24 AM
Hmmm... I guess I've been following Ed's advice too closely then?
Hermlord
02-13-2005, 05:34 AM
Edit: *I* Raise KQ, fold AJ. *You* should do what these other guys tell you.
bernie
02-13-2005, 05:38 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I know this has been debated plenty of times but I'm just curious as to what the general consensus is
[/ QUOTE ]
I guess you haven't read any of those debates, so we get yet another 'how to play AJo/KQo in EP' thread.
Don't worry, there'll be another one next week also. Maybe even 2 or three.
b
Danenania
02-13-2005, 05:38 AM
"Don't fold AJ."
But it makes me feel so self-disciplined!
bernie
02-13-2005, 05:39 AM
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Raise KQ, fold AJ.
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Can't wait to see the reasoning behind this. Let me go get a snack and get comfortable so I can take it all in stride.
b
Hermlord
02-13-2005, 05:40 AM
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Don't fold AJ.
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I know you're right, but I do it anyway. Why? Because I'm insane-ane-ane!!!
Nick C
02-13-2005, 06:05 AM
I don't think limping is so bad, but I usually raise.
I'm not sure I've ever played at a table where folding would be best.
Don't give advice that you will soon have to admit is wrong.
Alexthegreat
02-13-2005, 06:16 AM
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Don't give advice that you will soon have to admit is wrong.
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This should turn out nicely....
What do you mean? He already said that it was wrong. So its pretty much already ended, no?
Hermlord
02-13-2005, 06:31 AM
The question on the poll was basically "What do you do?" so I said what I did. I realized my reply looked like advice, so I edited it. And, yeah. That's pretty much it.
Michael Davis
02-13-2005, 06:32 AM
AJ better than KQ. AJ the most underrated hand in games where people coldcall with junk. AJ good hand.
-Michael
Nick C
02-13-2005, 06:51 AM
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AJ better than KQ. AJ the most underrated hand in games where people coldcall with junk. AJ good hand.
-Michael
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I guess it's a silly personal preference of mine, then, but I prefer KQo.
Generally speaking, though, I raise both of them. But I don't actually enjoy playing AJo very much, most of the time.
bobbyi
02-13-2005, 06:53 AM
In order to make the results meaningful, you really should specify how many people are in the game. In some places holdem is played nine-handed and in others it's ten, so we may have different ideas of how many people there are to act behind us if we are "UTG".
Is there any hand that you'd raise as the first to act in a 9 person game that you wouldn't in a 10 person game?
JoshuaD
02-13-2005, 06:56 AM
The poll would be alot more interesting if the question was "Who raises KJo UTG?"
I really hope that it wouldn't.
JoshuaD
02-13-2005, 07:01 AM
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I really hope that it wouldn't.
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Well, maybe it shouldn't be, but it would be to me. I often raise KJs from UTG, and I always feel a little urge to raise it when I see KJo.
Is the KJo raise bad?
Nick C
02-13-2005, 07:02 AM
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The poll would be alot more interesting if the question was "Who raises KJo UTG?"
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I pretty much always fold that one.
Such fine distinctions . . .
Yea, kill that urge. KJs is a raise though.
zaxx19
02-13-2005, 07:04 AM
I dont raise with either UTG...Im also a winning player who does quite well but unfortunately doest have PT...
Look if you want to raise with KQ or AJ UTG thats fine...Im just wondering what the hell you do when reraised ?? Is it an insta muck??
Is it an insta flop bluff on a ragged flop?? Your out of position...may have several callers..Id imagine your image would be pretty LAG if you are raising frequently in all positions.
THE BEST ? WOULD BE DO YOU RAISE WITH 88-99-1010 UTG. Remeber these can flop much harder than KQ and AJ(barring the freak straights) and actually have value on weak flops.
Michael Davis
02-13-2005, 07:05 AM
"Is the KJo raise bad?"
Not awful but not good either. What doesn't make sense is how the same people will jump all over you for not raising KQ and then for raising KJ.
-Michael
Michael Davis
02-13-2005, 07:06 AM
AJ has quite a lot of value on weak flops. KQ, not so much. KQ is much tougher to play well.
-Michael
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I dont raise with either UTG
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Any reason?
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Im also a winning player who does quite well but unfortunately doest have PT
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Any reason?
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Look if you want to raise with KQ or AJ UTG thats fine
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I am happy that you are fine with my decision to raise AJ and KQ UTG.
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Im just wondering what the hell you do when reraised ?? Is it an insta muck?? Is it an insta flop bluff on a ragged flop??
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No, few things in poker are an insta-anything. If I'm 3 bet or whiff the flop its insta-make poker decisions.
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Your out of position
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This makes those poker decisions harder.
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[you]may have several callers..Id imagine your image would be pretty LAG if you are raising frequently in all positions.
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these are all fairly hypothetical statements so I suppose there is little I can say other than, "yes." I also may flop the nuts or do one af a great many other things.
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THE BEST ? WOULD BE DO YOU RAISE WITH 88-99-1010 UTG.
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To be honest I don't think any of these preflop polls would be interesting because they end up devoting too much energy to stuff of too little importance.
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Remeber these can flop much harder than KQ and AJ(barring the freak straights) and actually have value on weak flops.
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This seems entirely subjective. What is flopping harder? Sets I guess, but its all pretty relative to the players and action.
Nick C
02-13-2005, 07:16 AM
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AJ has quite a lot of value on weak flops. KQ, not so much. KQ is much tougher to play well.
-Michael
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Yeah, I'll admit, this is the case -- especially when playing against people who cold-call with ace-rag.
I can't really explain why I prefer KQo.
But I'm not crazy about either hand, actually. I sometimes feel like I'm raising out of obligation, when I have AJo or KQo in EP.
Once I got AJo what seemed like four times in a row when UTG. I was sick of the hand, so I just folded it.
But I will admit it was a mistake.
private joker
02-13-2005, 07:30 AM
I have 16k hands or so of Party 2/4 in my PT and have gotten AJo 129 times. I raise with it from any position except the blinds unless the pot has already been raised, in which case I fold it. From UTG, where my PFR is 100%, I am winning 0.58bb/100 with it (and 0.52 overall).
I've had KQo 162 times, but only twice UTG -- I raised it both times and lost both hands. Overall I am winning with that hand at 0.31bb/100.
I will keep raising these guys. I'm also notoriously weak PF. My PFR overall is only 7.6, a number I am trying to bring up.
jason_t
02-13-2005, 07:59 AM
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From UTG, where my PFR is 100%
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What about this hand (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=1719460&page=2&view=c ollapsed&sb=5&o=14&fpart=1)? I ask because you say your PFR UTG is 100%, but also when I read this hand earlier today I wondered about the limp.
private joker
02-13-2005, 08:13 AM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
From UTG, where my PFR is 100%
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What about this hand (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=1719460&page=2&view=c ollapsed&sb=5&o=14&fpart=1)? I ask because you say your PFR UTG is 100%, but also when I read this hand earlier today I wondered about the limp.
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Read closer. My PFR with AJo is 100% UTG. Meaning I've raised it every time. Not that I raise every single hand I ever get UTG.
SinCityGuy
02-13-2005, 11:43 AM
In most games, I don't think you give up much by folding AJo and KQo UTG.
Instead of worrying about increasing the number of hands that you play UTG, focus more on playing more hands in LP and improving your post-flop play.
freakintemp
02-13-2005, 12:41 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
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From UTG, where my PFR is 100%
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What about this hand (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=1719460&page=2&view=c ollapsed&sb=5&o=14&fpart=1)? I ask because you say your PFR UTG is 100%, but also when I read this hand earlier today I wondered about the limp.
[/ QUOTE ]
Read closer. My PFR with AJo is 100% UTG. Meaning I've raised it every time. Not that I raise every single hand I ever get UTG.
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That would be pretty sick if you raised EVERY hand UTG on Party..... loses the effect of the straddle.
Freakin
jason_t
02-13-2005, 03:57 PM
I suspected that this would be your reply, but the statement was ambiguous and wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something. Thanks.
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