Somethings never change..the Mets will still suck in 05

[Mike Gallo]

As a Met fan, I have no hope for 2005. I just hope they keep it close until the trade deadline this year.

The Braves will probably win again for the the 13 straight year. The Nationals (Expos) will have have improved and the Phillies and Marlins will give the Braves fits.

Cellar dwellers again.

[BusterStacks]

Sports threads in OOT are gay.

[Clarkmeister]

Not.

[BusterStacks]

[ QUOTE ]
Not.

[/ QUOTE ]

nh

[scrub]

[ QUOTE ]
I just hope they keep it close until the trade deadline this year.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm a Mets sympathizer, if not a fan, and if they really do suck this year, I'd hate for it to be close until the trade deadline. When that happens, they tend to do stupid stuff like trade Kazmir...

scrub

[CCass]

I don't see how the Braves can do it this year. They are starting with Brian Jordan and Raul Mondesi in the outfield, and not a lot at 1st base.

[shadow29]

Of course the Braves will win this year. Again.

Too bad we can never make it in the NLCS.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't see how the Braves can do it this year.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've been hearing that for the last 5 years.

[Phat Mack]

I liked Henderson as a player, I wonder what kind of manager he'll make.

[Nate tha' Great]

How have the Nats improved? I don't like a single thing they've done this winter.

I'd give over-unders at about

Braves 90 wins
Phillies 89 wins
Marlins 87 wins
Mets 84 wins
Nationals 72 wins

[ClaytonN]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't see how the Braves can do it this year.

[/ QUOTE ]

Being in Atlanta, I've heard this phrase in spring training for the last 4 years, seriously.

Not like it matters. We are really good at getting 95 wins during the season then blowing up in the NLDS.

Screw the Braves, I want hockey back. Thrashers, mein.

[shadow29]

[ QUOTE ]

Marlins 87 wins
Mets 84 wins

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll take the under on both.

[Nate tha' Great]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Marlins 87 wins
Mets 84 wins

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll take the under on both.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd probably take the under on the Marlins and the over on the Mets, but I've got an insane amount of faith in Pedro.

I do think the Phillies are pretty much an astoundingly good bet at every sportsbook line that I've seen them at.

[shadow29]

[ QUOTE ]
I've got an insane amount of faith in Pedro.

I do think the Phillies are pretty much an astoundingly good bet at every sportsbook line that I've seen them at.

[/ QUOTE ]

Pedro is incredible, but he's only one guy. Phillies are a really good bet.

[sthief09]

you didn't like the Beltran signing?

[sthief09]

I can't wait for Kazmir to tear his labrum so I can forget about that trade. then again, Peterson probably wouldn't have let that happen

[Nate tha' Great]

[ QUOTE ]
you didn't like the Beltran signing?

[/ QUOTE ]

I do, but I take his performance pretty much as a given.

[sthief09]

how many wins do you think it'll take to win the WC this year? 90?

[Nate tha' Great]

[ QUOTE ]
how many wins do you think it'll take to win the WC this year? 90?

[/ QUOTE ]

Sounds about right. The West looks pretty weak this year and I can't say I like what the Cubs have done.

[Mike Gallo]

I liked Henderson as a player, I wonder what kind of manager he'll make.

Willie Randolph, his name is Willie Randolph.

Rough spot for a first time manager, rough spot.

Edited to correct spelling

[ QUOTE ]
I liked Henderson as a player, I wonder what kind of manager he'll make.

Willy Randolph, his name is Willy Randolph.

Rough spot for a first time manager, rough spot.

[/ QUOTE ]

Henderson, Randolph, what's the big deal.

But it's WILLIE not Willy for Christ's sake. And you call yourself a Mets fan? /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Mike Gallo]

you didn't like the Beltran signing?

Not as much as I would have liked them to have signed Vladdimir Guerrero last year.

They did this to cover up for the Vladdimir Guerrero debacle from last year. The Mets were determined to make a splash this year.

[sthief09]

vlad had no intentions of going to the mets

[sthief09]

yeah he has high expectations for a mediocre team. I have a lot of faith in Minaya though. some of the moves he made in montreal were pretty crappy (phillips, sizemore, and lee for colon) but he had to make something out of nothing, and he did a pretty good job.

[BottlesOf]

[ QUOTE ]
Mets 84 wins

[/ QUOTE ]

W0000000000T!!!


Ya gotta believe!!!

[Mike Gallo]

vlad had no intentions of going to the mets

Then dont make a half assed attempt at signing him the week before season tickets go on sale.

[Mike Gallo]

Thanks for the heads up.

And you call yourself a Mets fan?

Probably follower would fit better then "fan-atic" .

I also follow the Red Sox. I do this because they rival my cross town rival Yankees. Most of my family are die hard Yankee fans.

As a matter of fact the thing my mother said she will miss most about the WTC is having a ticker tape parade. She worked in building 2 and the office would stop and everyone would celebrate.

Thats my New York minute.

[sthief09]

well he used them to get more money. he's not the NY type. I don't think they made a half assed effort. that's one of the few things I don't blame them for

[Cornell Fiji]

I am a die hard Mets fan. I don't think that they will suck this season but unless Omar Minaya pulls off some really big midseason moves, which he says he intends on making in preseason interviews, they will be like many recent Mets teams, in contention at the break only to have a big losing streak to stay 6 or 7 games out of the wild card until they fade away at the end.

I love the acquisition of Pedro. I really can't agree with any of the valid reasons why that was a bad pick up but when this guy is pitching well he is Pedro [censored] Martinez. Even if they only get 2 years out of him and have to eat the contract this is a great deal.

The huge mistake that they made with Pedro is that they didn't add anyone to their bullpen. To add Pedro Martinez, who only averaged 6 2/3 ip per start to a rotation that already has Tom Glavine (6.1,) who is another year older, Steve Traschel (6.0,) Kris Benson (6.0,) an Victor Zambrano you are going to put a lot of straing on your bullpen. Everybody talks about how Pedro can't go deep in ballgames anymore, he had more innings pitched (217) than any Mets pitcher last season.

And Zambrano, this guy is going to have to become the next Doc Gooden or I'm going to still hate him and its not his fault. I think that the Zambrano trade was the worst trade that I have seen in my entire life. Even if the Mets scouting reports all said that this guy was never going to make it in the bigs and that they should trade him will they still could (obviously the reports said something more along the lines of: Kazmir is a future ace on any team.) but even if the reports said this - The Mets still got shafted on this deal! They traded a pitcher who EVERYONE ranked as the #1 pitching prospect in the league, who was the kind of guy you could build a franchise around, for nothing in return. Kazmir pitched in 25 games for the Mets in 2003 (18 in Capitol City and 7 in St. Lucie,) with a 2.63 era. He also averaged 12 strikeouts per 9 innings which was the best in the minor leagues. Scouts say that he has 3 pitches that are 'big league ready' and his fast ball is in the mid 90s with explosive movement. And I didn't event say the best part. He's a lefty. They traded this guy for Zambrano who gives up too many home runs and has control problems, not a good combination. Zambrano is also 28 and is eligible for arbitration next season, 2 years before Kazmir does, so not only is Zambrano a drastically worse pitcher than Kazmir but he is also older, and costs more. I was dumbfounded when I heard the deal but then I realized, thats what happens when you root for the Mets.

As far as Beltran goes, I would rather have Delgado. I was honestly hoping that the Yankees signed him. I had actually been talking excitedly with one of my best friends, also an avid Mets fan, after the World Series about how much Beltran was going to get paid in his next contract and how much we hoped the Yankees would be stupid enough to pick him up. If the Yankees were paying Beltran 17 mil a year as the Mets are it would really be costing them 34m due to the luxury tax, we thought this .270 hitter might be something to slow the Yankees spending down (note: we thought it would slow them down, that isn't to say they wouldn't have their name discussed for every major player when he is moving teams, that is to say that they might be slightly less inclined to take a big risk on a player such as Contreras or Brown in the future.) But, he is a Met now and he is a damn good ballplayer. It will be nice to have a gold glove center fielder. He did hit .270 last year but if you look at his stats he seems to alternate good years and bad years which bodes well for 2005. I think he was paid too much for his ability to steal bases. Don't get me wrong, it will be really fun to have a potential 40/40 guy on our team, but I just think that steals are a completely overrated statistic - I guess thats the effect that Moneyball has on people. Either way he is a huge improvement to the team.

Where is the opimism Mike? The Mets have as good of a 1-4 starters as anyone in the league and they have some bats that have had good seasons in the past. I love David Wright and if Reyes could ever stay healthy. If. Yea, I would love a better bullpen and of course I still wish that we had the 1999 infield of Olerud, Alfonzo, Ordonez, and Venura but the Mets did make two big pickups this season and Minaya is saying that they plan on making more. Of course the Mets say that they are willing to make moves to improve every year and obviously I believe that they have a chance every year only to have my heart broken once again.

But this time Mike, this time you gotta believe them. This is a good team and this season, if things go right the Mets will be playing some exciting, meaningfull late-September ballgames in 2005. And as Mets fans, thats all we really need isn't it?

-Steve

Edit: I will miss John Franco though. He was always one of my favorite players in baseball. I hope that when he retires he takes a job with the Mets. I think he will.

[sthief09]

you seem to know what you're talking about, but a slightly better hitting 32 year old 1b is not more valuable than a 27 year old CF

[Mike Gallo]

Where is the opimism Mike?

I have followed the Mets since the Tom Seaver for Pat Zachary Doug Flynn trade.

I watched a Mets team that should have dominated the late 80's and early 90's degenerate into infamy.

I do not have much optimism left, however I still believe /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Sooga]

I dunno man....... I really like the way the Marlins are looking this year, especially with that Delgado pickup.. They already have one of the best 1-5 rotations in the NL (perhaps arguably the best, now that Clement is gone in Chicago), their infield of Lowell, Gonzalez, Castillo, and Delgado has a fantastic balance of offense and defense, in the outfield, Cabrera is a stud, and Pierre and Encarnacion are pretty good at what they do. I think they're the team to beat in the East.

[ClaytonN]

[ QUOTE ]
I do not have much optimism left, however I still believe that the Mets will finish below the Braves again this year

[/ QUOTE ]

Fixed it for you /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[shadow29]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I do not have much optimism left, however I still believe that the Mets will finish below the Braves again this year

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

And it won't even be close...

[Cornell Fiji]

[ QUOTE ]
you seem to know what you're talking about, but a slightly better hitting 32 year old 1b is not more valuable than a 27 year old CF

[/ QUOTE ]


You are right. And the Mets did also did sign Mientkiewicz who is a gold glove first baseman. That definitely is a better combo than Cameron (/Valent) and Delgado. Beltran is a 27 year old Gold Glove center fielder who at his best can hit .300 and also put up 40/40 numbers. I don't think that Beltran's contract is good and I am worried that it is going to handcuff the Mets in the future if he turns out to be the .270 hitter that he is in even yeared seasons. At 13 mil for 4 years (2/3s of Beltrands deal in years and salary) Delgado would have been a lower risk and alowed them more flexability but you are right, the Mets are better off with Beltran than Delgado. I guess I am just disapointed because I was already in the mindset to root against him when he was in pinstripes. He would have been a terrible signing for that team and if they had to effectively handcuff themselves $38 mil/year I thought it might slow them down and that, combined with the Mets getting Delgado (and maybe someone like Eric Davis to fill in for Cameron) wouldn't have been that bad of an alternative.

-Steve

[Cornell Fiji]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I do not have much optimism left, however I still believe that the Mets will finish below the Braves again this year

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

And it won't even be close...

[/ QUOTE ]


The Braves will win the division. I will belive this every season until the day that they are mathematically eliminated (I suspect this will be sometime this decade.) Right now, I see it as much of a sure thing as the fact that when in the playoffs there will be thousands of empty seats in the stands for every single game.

I think that the Mets will make a run at it though. and if they play well there is no reason why they couldn't win the wild card and if so, with their pitching staff, they have a chance to win it all.

-Steve

[PhatTBoll]

well at least your team's marquee offseason pickup wasn't Eric Milton.

Reds baby w00000t!!!1

[Nate tha' Great]

[ QUOTE ]
I dunno man....... I really like the way the Marlins are looking this year, especially with that Delgado pickup.. They already have one of the best 1-5 rotations in the NL (perhaps arguably the best, now that Clement is gone in Chicago), their infield of Lowell, Gonzalez, Castillo, and Delgado has a fantastic balance of offense and defense

[/ QUOTE ]

Meaning two of the guys can't hit and two of the guys can't field? ;-)

[ QUOTE ]
in the outfield, Cabrera is a stud, and Pierre and Encarnacion are pretty good at what they do. I think they're the team to beat in the East.

[/ QUOTE ]

They're a good club. I don't think the offense is quite good enough to win the division on its own - though Delgado is EXACTLY what they needed - but if the pitching stays healthy they'll be very, very tough.

[sthief09]

if anything is going to handcuff them in the future, it's Pedro and Glavine, not Beltran. asnd think about the future. good hitting 1b's are a dime a dozen. sure, few hit as well as Delgado, but for a minor difference in hitting, you could find a cheap guy. once Aubrey comes up for the Indians, I bet they'll be looking to deal Hafner, a cheap, decent hitting, non-flashy guy that a contending team would love to plug in at 1b (even if he can't field for [censored]). it'll cost someone a B level prospect. things like that happen all the time. Beltran and Mientkiewicz might not make them a better hitting combo than Cameron/Delgado, but think about the future. it'll be a lot easier to find a 1b than a CF

[Phat Mack]

[ QUOTE ]
I liked Henderson as a player, I wonder what kind of manager he'll make.

Willie Randolph, his name is Willie Randolph.


[/ QUOTE ]

At least I've stopped referring to him as "Mickey Rivers."

"He walks like an arthritic sharecropper, but he runs like a gazelle...."
--Bigboy Medlin on Randolf