Two Mid Pair Hands [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

fsuplayer

02-07-2005, 05:36 PM

These both felt bad.

villian in hand 1 is a 28/9 in my stats, but i have only played 35 hands w him.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9/images/graemlins/club.gif, 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG calls, UTG+1 raises, 7 folds, Hero calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (6.66 SB) 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 7/images/graemlins/club.gif, 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 bets, Hero raises, UTG calls, UTG+1 3-bets, Hero calls, UTG calls.

Turn: (7.83 BB) T/images/graemlins/club.gif (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 bets, Hero calls, UTG calls.

River: (10.83 BB) 2/images/graemlins/club.gif (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 bets, Hero calls, UTG folds.

Final Pot: 12.83 BB

no notes on villian at the time of hand 2.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
UTG raises, 2 folds, MP1 3-bets, MP2 calls, 2 folds, Hero calls, 2 folds, UTG calls.

Flop: (13.66 SB) T/images/graemlins/club.gif, 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (4 players)
UTG checks, MP1 checks, MP2 bets, Hero calls, UTG raises, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (9.83 BB) Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players)
UTG bets, MP2 folds, Hero calls.

River: (11.83 BB) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
UTG bets, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 12.83 BB

thoughts on all streets appreciated.

thanks,

fsuplayer

JasonP530

02-07-2005, 05:45 PM

Sprayed a lot of chips in both hands. The first hand I would check call and lead the river. Second hand you should raise the flop and see what happens. given that action, I think you should fold the flop when the PFR checkraises the field.

fsuplayer

02-07-2005, 06:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Sprayed a lot of chips in both hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

agreed.

[ QUOTE ]
The first hand I would check call and lead the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

of all the streets, in both hands combined, this way the only one I was not curious about.

I thought this was a no brainer CR, esp. with the UTG in between myself and the pfr.

anybody else not CR this flop?

TStoneMBD

02-07-2005, 08:22 PM

first hand is standard. second hand is bad.

bobbyi

02-07-2005, 08:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I thought this was a no brainer CR, esp. with the UTG in between myself and the pfr.

anybody else not CR this flop?

[/ QUOTE ]
No. You definitely need to CR there.

Brom

02-07-2005, 09:00 PM

Hand #1 looks pretty good to me.

In hand #2 I don't really like the PF call of 3 cold while only getting about 3:1 for your money. You can easily be up against a higher pocket pair and a whole slew of overcards. Then, on the flop, UTG+1 check raises everyone and you get about 19:1 to peel one off here closing the action so I'd probably take that. However I'd say fold to the turn bet. Hands that beat you: AA-88+44, AQ/T, KQ/J, QJ/T, JT, and you are drawing dead to some of these. Hands that you beat: AK/J (and your drawing dead on AJ even). It's not your job to sheriff here.

stoxtrader

02-07-2005, 09:24 PM

hand 1 is well played, you have no way of knowing if villain has a higher overpair, or is getting frisky with overcards or a flush draw. in either event, the best play is to call down.

hand 2 - pre-flop is ok, but i still struggle with what pairs this is not ok, 55 ok, but 44 not cause it makes less straights? the flop play I think you need to raise great opportunity to get it heads up and see a showdown cheap OR fold if it gets capped and is 2 back to you...

fsuplayer

02-07-2005, 09:36 PM

hand 1, i guess was better than i thought. this is my normal line here, which is why I wanted to check it.

i wasnt sure if 'close my eyes and call down' was correct here, but apparently its ok.

the second hand was a freakin mess. im not sure what was going through my head at the time, maybe nothing /images/graemlins/tongue.gif.

preflop there is automatic, and I make that call with any pair with any loose players behind me, but maybe that is a small leak. its going to be at least 4 ways, with 5 or so left to act behind me.

i would think that 77 and up is a sure thing however stox.

i need to raise the flop on the second hand.

thanks for the responses guys.

fsuplayer

btw on the first hand villian had QQ and MHWNG.

bobbyi

02-07-2005, 09:43 PM

[ QUOTE ]
hand 1, i guess was better than i thought. this is my normal line here, which is why I wanted to check it.

i wasnt sure if 'close my eyes and call down' was correct here, but apparently its ok.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't play the 15/30 on party and my impression is that it is more aggressive than my local mid-limit games. In my games, calling down would not be ok on hand 1. There is no flush draw (on the flop) and no straight draw that someone raising early should realistically have hit, so he either has a bigger pair than you or has overcards. The people I play with would not three-bet this flop with just overcards and if they did, it would probably be to take a free card on the turn. So I do not regard the call-down once you get three-bet as standard or good, although the initial check-raise was necessary because at that point he could easily have just overcards and you need to knock out UTG in case he does (and also help define his hand, although if you feel obligated to call down even if he three-bets, then that part isn't really working for you). But I will admit it could be possible that this is a fine calldown in the game you were playing. If there were realistic draws on the flop, it's a different story and then folding would certainly be bad unless you knew the opponent well.