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View Full Version : TPTK against possible made flush

Stefan Prodan
02-01-2005, 03:42 PM
Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

Flop: (8.50 SB) 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB folds, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls.

Turn: (7.75 BB) 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
MP1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 raises</font>, Hero calls.

River: (11.75 BB) 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">MP1 bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 13.75 BB

MP1 seems like a good player, strictly from a numbers standpoint. 19% VPIP, 2.5 total AF. I usually 4-table and didn't have a real behavioral read other than that.

Hence, I wasn't sure that he would play a flush draw this way on the flop. What do you check raise into two people with a flush draw for? It's not really a value bet. Or maybe it is, but barely. What is he hoping to accomplish? I'm not sure. That's why I figured he probably didn't have a flush, maybe a high ace or something of that nature. I didn't give him any credit for a straight because who with a 19% VPIP calls with 35 in MP1? Two pair might have been likely, but I still liked my hand, so I 3-bet.

When the turn came and he checked, I figured he probably didn't have the flush. I reconsidered when I was check-raised, but at that point I thought the pot was big enough to be worth calling down with only one other hand to beat.
spydog
02-01-2005, 03:50 PM
MP1 has witnessed the following from you:

1) Preflop raise
2) Flop 3-bet when an Ace hits
3) Turn bet

He will not try to push you off an Ace by bluffing the flush card. He knows you will call down (99.9% of all players do). So, when he checkraises he is telling you he can beat TPTK. FOLD.
Derek in NYC
02-01-2005, 03:58 PM
I play it the same. 65% of the time, I read this as an overplayed ace like AJ-AXs. I dont read flush, because it would be more natural for him to lead the flop rather than checkraise the flop. I'd say flush only 20% of the time. Remaining 15% of the time, you are up against a set, and if so, oh well, you lose.
spydog
02-01-2005, 04:01 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I dont read flush, because it would be more natural for him to lead the flop rather than checkraise the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

If he has the flush draw then he will not lead into the PFR, who is sitting to his immediate left. He will check the flop...hope that Hero bets....hope that 1 or more people call...then checkraise his draw for value.
Fat Nicky
02-01-2005, 04:03 PM
Call down and take a note on MP1.
Fat Nicky
02-01-2005, 04:06 PM
[ QUOTE ]
If he has the flush draw then he will not lead into the PFR, who is sitting to his immediate left. He will check the flop...hope that Hero bets....hope that 1 or more people call...then checkraise his draw for value.


[/ QUOTE ]

Unless you have a impeccable read, assuming a typical Party 2/4 player is thinking at this level could be a mistake and cause some major misreads.
spydog
02-01-2005, 04:19 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If he has the flush draw then he will not lead into the PFR, who is sitting to his immediate left. He will check the flop...hope that Hero bets....hope that 1 or more people call...then checkraise his draw for value.


[/ QUOTE ]

Unless you have a impeccable read, assuming a typical Party 2/4 player is thinking at this level could be a mistake and cause some major misreads.

[/ QUOTE ]

He said he was a TAG. I'm not saying he has a flush. I'm saying his flop play shouldn't rule out the possibility of a flush.

Besides, he CRed the flop against a TAG PFR with an Ace showing. Smooth called the 3-bet. Then, CRed the turn. And you call this down? You are good or chop here 5% of the time. The other 95% you are drawing dead.