Folding AK

[jcm4ccc]

any comments? $6 Turbo

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t50 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Button (t1525)
SB (t1980)
BB (t3387)
UTG (t1875)
UTG+1 (t1260)
MP1 (t1427)
MP2 (t666)
Hero (t1380)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 raises to t250</font>, <font color="#666666">5 folds</font>.

Final Pot: t325

Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF">
No showdown. MP1 wins t325. </font>

[Big Limpin']

I guess im cool with that. but im sure pushing back at him is +EV. If not flipping, you dominate him on non-pp more often thatn he has AA/KK.

and, you have position, so smooth call and see flop then decide sounds good too.


I guess you are trying to insinute that this super-smart play by you, but frankly, i dont agree. You'd have to REALLY be able to outplay the opponents to muck AK preflop

[jcm4ccc]

god, no, i wasn't implying this was super-smart. i was looking for input.

[jcm4ccc]

I don't want to go all-in this early. How do you win chips on this hand if the flop doesn't hit you? I hate to bluff on the flop when i didn't raise preflop.

[Big Limpin']

if you push back:
-he folds (unlikely) and you take 500+blinds
-he calls...like i said, i think if its not a flip, you are more likely ahead (AQ vs AK) than behind (AA vs AK, or kkvsAK)


If you smooth call:

-THe flop has A or K...you likely win it
-No A or K, and he leads yto you, you lose 500
-No A or K, he checks...i dunno. your call

I guess my take on this hand is that dodging his bet, and pretending you were dealt 27o isnt too bad..If you feel you are better than most at the table.

Personally though, i cant fold this.

[Sidekick]

At the $6 + $0.50 Turbos at PS I think folding this preflop is terribly weak.

Unless I have seen this player previously make such a large bet with AA or KK preflop then I either smooth call or come over the top. Most of the time when I see bets this large relative to the blinds in the first couple of rounds at the $6.5 Turbos, it is a weaker hand that really doesn't want to see any action or is being greatly over valued (e.g. AJs, ATs, JJ, TT, Ax or even smaller pocket pairs).

If your post flop skills are good, then I think smooth calling here is a fine play. If you are worried about your post flop skills then I think you should push. Everything I've seen and read indicates that AK works best with a full board.

If you have a large raise with a reraise in front of you (or even more action), then I can see folding preflop. But in this situation I think folding is terribly weak.

If this comes across as harsh it isn't meant to be. AK is just too strong of a hand to lay down preflop for a 250 bet when that isn't even 20% of your chips.

[Iconoclastic]

I don't play Turbos much, but I would think that the faster blind levels plus the overraise indicating that he doesn't want a call would push you toward, well, a push. Chances are you dominate him more than he has AA, or more likely KK. Reads would be helpful too.

[Scuba Chuck]

JCM, good question.

I don't understand the game structure at P*s, so I don't know if this clouds my thoughts.

First thought. Did you ultimately place ITM?
Is your bubble play solid? Do you believe you have superior skills than your competition?

If you answered yes to the latter two questions, then a fold is "worth" it. Is it a plus EV situation? I think this is an endlessly debatable proposition.

[wegs the wegs]

A $6 turbo on Stars... wouldn't surprise me if he called your all-in with A2. You have to call here. If you have seen him play AA or KK the exact same way before this than it can be thrown away. My move here is call, if you hit A or K then you push him if he bets or pot size it if he checks. If he comes back over you, call and cross your fingers.

[Michael C.]

I would push here on a $6 table. There are so many hands that he could be playing that most likely you're ahead. I think it's plus EV, and if you lose, just start another one. I don't really like smooth calling because I think it's harder to play a flop in this case against a bad player than a good one, i.e. almost any card could have hit him.

[Sluss]

This is an auto push for me. You will see any A call here and a pretty good shot you won't see AA or KK because "those hands are too good to raise this much pre-flop." Sometimes you will see a smaller pocket pair, but the times you will see these and lose the coinflip will be less than you double up.

[jcm4ccc]

I don't think you can discount AA or KK, because people play kind of crazy at the $6 Turbos. I would put MP1 on the following hands:

AA - 88
AK - AT

According to PokerStove, I would win 55% of the time if I went all-in against those hands.

So is folding better than pushing?

Fold:
I would win 10.7% of the prize pool (ICM calculations)

All-in (assuming he calls, which I think is a fair assumption on the $6 Turbos):
55% of the time: 20% of the prize pool
45% of the time: 0% of the prize pool

equals
11% of the prize pool.


So folding and pushing are about even. I would opt for folding then, because I think I am better than the average $6 Turbo player.

However, I probably should stop being a wimp and call his bet, rather than fold.