SAGES NEEEDED: Solve my equity dilemma (very brief...I promise)

[oreogod]

Three questions actually.

1. When u are on the flop, with a flush draw (35 percent) and there is 5 players in the pot, I understand that u want to raise for value. Heres the question, when u get to the turn, do u still raise if there is 5 players, because now your flush draw is at 19.6 percent chance if u havent hit yet, below ur 20 percent contribution to the pot. Or does it even matter.

1a. Odds, question. When u guys are on the flop do u use the odds for one card to come or two cards to come. When I am on the flop with a flush draw I use the odds for one card to come and am usually looking for 4:1 odds to continue, correct or not?

2.Last equity question, it would seem to me if u are in a pot with 3-5 players seeing a flop, if u have a holding that has at least 8 or more clean outs that u would want to raise for value with what ever it is that u have. Correct or not?

Alright thats it, anyway I suppose this could go on the probabiliy forum, but I rather like this one, and it seems to get the most action, so my bad if anyone feels different.

Thanks guys, and ladies if u are out there.

[Dave H.]

Try this thread for some very good info regarding your questions... Info on Value Betting OESD and flush draws (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=genpok&Number=1455444& Forum=,All_Forums,&Words=&Searchpage=1&Limit=25&Ma in=1455444&Search=true&where=bodysub&Name=17863&da terange=1&newerval=&newertype=&olderval=1&oldertyp e=w&bodyprev=#Post1455444)

[LinusKS]

The answer to your question is kind of complicated, I think, but I also think you're coming at it from the wrong direction. - you need also to take position into account, as well as the chance that someone with a better hand might fold.

From early position, I don't think it's a good idea to bet. If you knew everybody would just call, that would be fine. But you don't know that. If there's a TPTK out there - for instance - you don't really want him raising you and driving everyone else out.

On the other hand, from late position, you're in a better position to bet because you have more information. If everybody checks, for instance, they've demonstrated weakness, and you should probably bet to take advantage of the semi-bluff as well as the chance you'll make your flush. If you get a couple or three folds here, you can bet out again on the turn and stand a reasonable chance of taking down the pot on a bluff.

If your decision is only whether to fold or call, you should look at only the chance you'll make your hand on the next card. If you're counting the next two cards as outs, you have to consider you may have to pay two bets (or more) to see them.

Also, be careful about assuming your outs are good. What I'm saying is, if you think you're drawing to the best hand when you're not, you could be giving away implied odds to someone who's drawing better than you, and you can't always know what other people are drawing to (eg, flush over flush, boat over flush, boat over boat, etc.)

[jedi]

[ QUOTE ]
Three questions actually.

[b]1. When u are on the flop, with a flush draw (35 percent) and there is 5 players in the pot, I understand that u want to raise for value. Heres the question, when u get to the turn, do u still raise if there is 5 players, because now your flush draw is at 19.6 percent chance if u havent hit yet, below ur 20 percent contribution to the pot. Or does it even matter.


[/ QUOTE ]

On the turn, it depends on what I have, what my position is, and what the board and my opponents are like.

You're rarely ONLY going to have a flush draw. If I have the flush draw and a pair, I'm still going to be raising. If I have a flush draw and 2 overcards, I'm going to be raising. Exceptions are if I got 3-bet on the flop, indicating a better than 1-pair type of hand from my opponent.

If I have less than a pair with the flush draw, I'll call or take the free card if it's offered to me.