**OFFICIAL THREAD** Super Bowl XXXIX -- Patriots vs Eagles

[Homer]

Might as well get the ball rolling. What will the opening line be? I'm thinking Pats -5.5 or 6.

[BottlesOf]

That sounds reasonable.

[Leo99]

You might be right about the spread. If the Eagles play a hair better than they did agains the Falcons and have a healthy T.O. then I think they can beat the Pats in a close game. I'd much rather have them play the Steelers but we'll take the Pats. Can I say "we"? I have an old Cunningham shirt.

[Greenthumb]

a better thread title would be
**OFFICIAL THREAD..SUPER BOWL XXXIX CHAMPIONS NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS**
EDIT: but i dont want to seem over confident

[Homer]

[ QUOTE ]
a better thread title would be
**OFFICIAL THREAD..SUPER BOWL XXXIX CHAMPIONS NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS**

[/ QUOTE ]

No, that would suck. Nice try at ripping on the Eagles, though.

[tolbiny]

I'm putting 300 on belicheck straight up

[Homer]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm putting 300 on belicheck straight up

[/ QUOTE ]

Belichick

[lastchance]

NE is just so good though. Have you been watching these games against Pitt and Indianopolis, two of the top 4 teams in the NFL?

If Belicheck and NE doesn't overlook Philly, and they're not going to, NE just wins.

[Greenthumb]

Nice try?i think it was pretty successful.

[Homer]

[ QUOTE ]
Nice try?i think it was pretty successful.

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe for riling up some of the fucktard Eagles posters.

[Greenthumb]

point taken.

[Zoltri]

Olympic already has a line up for the game.

New England Patriots -6 -115 46(O/U) -300(ML)
Philadelphia Eagles -105 +220(ML)

[Homer]

[ QUOTE ]
NE is just so good though. Have you been watching these games against Pitt and Indianopolis, two of the top 4 teams in the NFL?

If Belicheck and NE doesn't overlook Philly, and they're not going to, NE just wins.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's why I figured the line would be NE -5.5 or 6.

[Homer]

[ QUOTE ]
Olympic already has a line up for the game.

New England Patriots -6 -115 46(O/U) -300(ML)
Philadelphia Eagles -105 +220(ML)

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm good.

[Dynasty]

[ QUOTE ]
Olympic already has a line up for the game.

New England Patriots -6 -115 46(O/U) -300(ML)
Philadelphia Eagles -105 +220(ML)

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you provide a link, please?

[Zoltri]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Olympic already has a line up for the game.

New England Patriots -6 -115 46(O/U) -300(ML)
Philadelphia Eagles -105 +220(ML)

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you provide a link, please?

[/ QUOTE ]
There you go (http://www.thegreek.com/)

[private joker]

You know what would be funny? If Pittsburgh comes back and wins this game. Then we've got on our hands another...

http://www.loc.gov/exhibits/treasures/images/at0069_4s.jpg

[Toro]

Watching the 5th quarter now. Lobel reports this Super Bowl package that's on line for sale. 8 tickets and a house for the week for a mere $125,000. Any takers?

[Voltron87]

It pains me to say this, but "fly eagles fly!"...

[CCx]

Eagles win this one - going to be an incredible game with amazing coaches on both sidelines, and OWENS WILL BE PLAYING IN THE SUPER BOWL!!!

No one i'd rather face than the defending champions, the Eagles will come away victorious, and tonight's celebration on Broad Street will look like nothing compared to what's gonna happen in two weeks!

[DemonDeac]

the emotional high the eagles will be riding cuz of TO's return and cuz of finally getting over the hump and reach the super bowl will allow us to win in a very close game.

they still won't be able to cover westbrook, who is always key. and now they'll have TO to contend with as well.

[Lazymeatball]

Two weeks from now it will be official. Pats are the team of the decade. Sorry Eagles fans, you can say Philly has more of a chance than people give them credit for, or that they will make a good game of it, but to predict victory is sheer lunacy.

[CCx]

[ QUOTE ]
Two weeks from now it will be official. Pats are the team of the decade. Sorry Eagles fans, you can say Philly has more of a chance than people give them credit for, or that they will make a good game of it, but to predict victory is sheer lunacy.

[/ QUOTE ]

Any given Sunday.....except on this Sunday, when we WHOOP THE PATS ASS!!!!! It will be a fantastic game, but the EAGLES WILL BE SUPER BOWL CHAMPS! For you to say otherwise is lunacy.... LOL /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[Greenthumb]

you cant blame the eagles fans though. imagine if it was our team that was the worse team..wed still say they were going to win. they have to stay faithfull, however uneducated and stupid the thought that they will win might be. you know?

[kenberman]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Two weeks from now it will be official. Pats are the team of the decade. Sorry Eagles fans, you can say Philly has more of a chance than people give them credit for, or that they will make a good game of it, but to predict victory is sheer lunacy.

[/ QUOTE ]

Any given Sunday.....except on this Sunday, when we WHOOP THE PATS ASS!!!!! It will be a fantastic game, but the EAGLES WILL BE SUPER BOWL CHAMPS! For you to say otherwise is lunacy.... LOL /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

The Patriots are better in every aspect of the game than the Eagles. Rushing, passing, defense, special teams, coaching, playoff experience. I don't see how the Eagles will keep this one close.

[daryn]

well, we've been in the worse team situation before. i remember being confident, maybe saying that i liked our chances.. that's about it. hardly obnoxious.

[CCx]

[ QUOTE ]
you cant blame the eagles fans though. imagine if it was our team that was the worse team..wed still say they were going to win. they have to stay faithfull, however uneducated and stupid the thought that they will win might be. you know?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's not uneducated or stupid...wake up man...who gave the Pats a shot against the Rams....wake up, EAGLES GOT SOMETHIN' FOR YOU GUYS....uneducated and stupid, that's some ignorant sh!t ..

[Greenthumb]

exactly what i expect an eagles fan to think. like i said i cant blame you for staying hopefull.

[CCx]

[ QUOTE ]
exactly what i expect an eagles fan to think

[/ QUOTE ]

More ignorance...nothing like the internet to bring out people like YOU. Good luck, it's going to be a hell of a game, but dont discount anything the Eagles did this year, and it's going to be a fantastic game

We'll see, we'll see, we'll see - but the BIRDS WILL WIN THE GAME!!! E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Greenthumb]

ok ok, it MIGHT be a hell of a game, if the eagles can play there best game of the year. we will both enjoy it equally and both stay confident till the end, so lets just let the players finish this argument.
by the way, great quote- "i call the big one bitey"

[CCx]

gotcha, see you in two weeks /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Greenthumb]

i was almost sure your post in vulture's thread was gonna make fun of the fact that i sleep on a futon..but anywho good luck and i also want to point out that ive moved up from "stranger" to "newbie"..im so honored

[RogerZBT]

I'm going with the Patriots. I agree with kenberman that the Pats just do most things better. I don't think that translates into a blowout though, since the differences, for the most part, are relatively minor.

Two things I would be worried about if I was a Eagles fan. One is the let down of just having won the NFC. The second is TO. I'm not sure that they weren't playing better without him than they were wtih him and who knows how effective he'll be. That, plus the questions about "Will he/won't he?" (even though I'm sure he will) could be a distraction.

I like the Pats to win, but I'lll have to see where the line settles to decide whether or not they'll cover.

[CCx]

[ QUOTE ]
That, plus the questions about "Will he/won't he?" (even though I'm sure he will) could be a distraction.

[/ QUOTE ]

Its already been said that he'll be playing in the local media here, so I doubt this will be a distraction.

You seem like a nice enough guy, but your comment about them playing better without him is just nuts. They were the second best offense in the league this year behind the Colts during the 14 games they had T.O.

Also, early line seems to be Eagles +6.5/+7 - I'm ALL over this at +7

[kenberman]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think that translates into a blowout though, since the differences, for the most part, are relatively minor.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think the differences are minor, and I base this mainly on the difference between the AFC and NFC this year. If you look at a quick look at the statistics, then sure the teams look similar. But once you weigh strength of schedule into it, the Patriots come out way ahead. By this ranking (http://teamrankings.com/nfl/27powerratings.php3) ,the Eagles played the weakest schedule in the league this year.

Take Points Against, for instance. Both teams allowed 16.3 PPG this year. But the Patriots did this against much tougher teams. The Patriots scored 3 more PPG than the Eagles, again, against better competition. There weren't many - if any - big wins by NFC teams vs AFC teams this year, and this is significant.

The Patriots just scored 41 points against the NFL's best defense, and the week before held the NFL's best offense to 3 points. The Eagles looked pretty good against 2 decent teams. Eagles are the class of the NFC, and a good team, but were probably the 4th best team in the NFL this year.

[RogerZBT]

[ QUOTE ]
Its already been said that he'll be playing in the local media here, so I doubt this will be a distraction.

You seem like a nice enough guy, but your comment about them playing better without him is just nuts. They were the second best offense in the league this year behind the Colts during the 14 games they had T.O.

Also, early line seems to be Eagles +6.5/+7 - I'm ALL over this at +7

[/ QUOTE ]

Well I'm sure you've seen more of them than I, so I can't really debate whether or not they're really better. I can only say what I've seen. IMO, the offense has looked much more productive and balanced than when TO is around, and I've always thought his antics and ego have been a distraction. I think the other receivers have more than filled in, so you get TO-level production with happier player (because the passes are being spread around) and without the headaches. Just my $0.02

[BottlesOf]

Predictions on a) how many replies will this thread get? and b) will it make the front OOT page on Superbowl Sunday?

[andyfox]

If that's it, I'll take the Pats. It will be a blow-out.

[mojorisin24]

Patriots all the way, baby. We've smashed the Colts and Steelers on back-to-back weeks, and although I respect the Eagles, they're just in the wrong place and wrong time in history.

[RogerZBT]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think the differences are minor, and I base this mainly on the difference between the AFC and NFC this year. If you look at a quick look at the statistics, then sure the teams look similar. But once you weigh strength of schedule into it, the Patriots come out way ahead. By this ranking (http://teamrankings.com/nfl/27powerratings.php3) ,the Eagles played the weakest schedule in the league this year.

Take Points Against, for instance. Both teams allowed 16.3 PPG this year. But the Patriots did this against much tougher teams. The Patriots scored 3 more PPG than the Eagles, again, against better competition. There weren't many - if any - big wins by NFC teams vs AFC teams this year, and this is significant.

The Patriots just scored 41 points against the NFL's best defense, and the week before held the NFL's best offense to 3 points. The Eagles looked pretty good against 2 decent teams. Eagles are the class of the NFC, and a good team, but were probably the 4th best team in the NFL this year.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ehh... I think this is one case where those stats don't tell the whole story. Yeah, they shut down Indy, but Peyton always sucks in Foxboro and the weather really favored NE. They scored 41 against Pitt, but 17 points came off the INT's, and the last touchdown was when the game was out of reach and was barely contested. It's not like NE with 322 total yards put on an offensive clinic.

I trust my eyes over a computer and going by what I've seen, NE is better, but not blowout better.

[jstnrgrs]

[ QUOTE ]
b) will it make the front OOT page on Superbowl Sunday?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll lay 10 to 1 that this thread makes the front page on OOT on Super Bowl Sunday.

[daryn]

ok, how large of a wager will you accept?

[jstnrgrs]

well, how large do you want to go? How this, if this thread apears on the front page of OOT at any time on Super Bowl Sunday, I will pay you $5000. If not, you pay me $500. Is that large enough, or would you like to go larger?

[daryn]

i would prefer to go larger

[daryn]

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In risposta di:</font><hr />
well, how large do you want to go? How this, if this thread apears on the front page of OOT at any time on Super Bowl Sunday, I will pay you $5000. If not, you pay me $500. Is that large enough, or would you like to go larger?

[/ QUOTE ]



sigh. i'm such a nice guy, i'll let you keep your cash.

the blunder you made here was that you assumed you had a lock bet. i did the same. who is right?

well, i am of course. i'm sure i could get mat to lock the thread with little trouble (especially if i give him $1,000), and it would fade away to the back pages in no time.

lesson: think before you make dumb bets.

[CCx]

I am going to enjoy the hell out of these next two weeks with everybody nut-riding the Patriots, and saying how much BETTER they are than the Eagles. The way I see it, the only place where they dominate the Eagles is in Super Bowl experience, which is definitely not something to shake a stick at. Any other facet of the football game can be argued is close to evenly matched (for anyone that has spent significant time watching both teams this year, not just watching both teams play in the last two weeks). Now that the Eagles have the monkey off their back of winning the NFC Championship, it's about to be on in a big way - T.O. will be playing in the Super Bowl, and this is OUR year! GO EAGLES!

[Zoltri]

[ QUOTE ]
T.O. will be playing in the Super Bowl

[/ QUOTE ]
If Owens is not at least 90%, I would not use him.
I like how everyone has taken a role and Andy Reid should be commended how he alternates his personnel especially Westbrook, Levens and the receivers.

[Homer]

[ QUOTE ]
you cant blame the eagles fans though. imagine if it was our team that was the worse team..wed still say they were going to win. they have to stay faithfull, however uneducated and stupid the thought that they will win might be. you know?

[/ QUOTE ]

I wouldn't say it's uneducated and stupid to think the Eagles are going to win. I mean, look at all the people who bitch when they flop a four-flush and it doesn't come in. That is even more silly, but no one really gives that a second thought. It's a little naive to think the Eagles are going to win this game more than 50% of the time, but to predict victory is not a big deal.

[tolbiny]

Because he is so tricky, i like to think of him as
Beli-Check-RAISE!!!!

[Daliman]

If Owens were completely healthy and had never injured his ankle, this would be one of the best matchups in SB history, and a likely pick'em. Owens playing helps, if he can, but I don't know that he will be close enough to 100% to tilt the balance. I think NE will win, and much as I like Brady, I shudder at the thought of hearing for another year how he is the best QB in football and al he does is win the big games. Right up there with "big-game experience" being a major factor in games. How much big game experience did Brady have his first SB vs a team with a lot? How much did the pistons have last year vs a team with a ton? Definite candidtate for most overrated intangible.

[daryn]

yeah man brady sucks /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[mojorisin24]

Seriously, big-game experience is the "most overrated intangible?" Are you kidding me? You ask "What big-game experience did Brady have before he played the Rams a few years ago?," forgetting that he was coming off a stunning victory over the Raiders in the Snow Bowl and a half-game of good quarterbacking (before getting hurt) on the road against Pittsburgh. Brady had to earn his playoff reputation, which he has done over and over and over. People out there who doubt Brady just make themselves look foolish, acting as though what he has accomplished is due to the defense he plays with. But looking back through history, all dominant postseason teams, be they those with Bradshaw, Montana, Aikman, et al, have had top-notch defenses. Look at what's happened to Peyton Manning: he puts up all the numbers and wins in the regular season, but he simply cannot win in the playoffs against good teams. But Brady? He punches the vaunted Steelers defense right in the mouth with a 60-yard bomb on the first play off of a Bettis turnover yesterday, shutting up the Heinz Field crowd and also all the idiot football "analysts" who once again picked the Patriots to lose. Big-game quarterbacks make plays like that; non-big-game QB's do not (see Manning, Peyton and Pennington, Chad).

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
You might be right about the spread. If the Eagles play a hair better than they did agains the Falcons and have a healthy T.O. then I think they can beat the Pats in a close game. I'd much rather have them play the Steelers but we'll take the Pats. Can I say "we"? I have an old Cunningham shirt.

[/ QUOTE ]
Is T.O. supposed to be "healthy"? I thought he could play, but how healthy is "healthy"? 25%? With that said I hope he plays and breaks his leg. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[daryn]

that throw was awesome by the way. it couldn't have been better thrown.

[CCx]

[ QUOTE ]
Is T.O. supposed to be "healthy"? I thought he could play, but how healthy is "healthy"? 25%? With that said I hope he plays and breaks his leg. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

It has already been reported that TO will be playing in the Super Bowl as the Eagles third receiver. If things go well, maybe that prognosis could be upgraded, but that is what is being reported as of this afternoon here in Philly.

I hope you break your leg falling down the steps today. /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
I hope you break your leg falling down the steps today. /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[/ QUOTE ]
Don't be hatin'. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Daliman]

[ QUOTE ]
Seriously, big-game experience is the "most overrated intangible?" Are you kidding me? You ask "What big-game experience did Brady have before he played the Rams a few years ago?," forgetting that he was coming off a stunning victory over the Raiders in the Snow Bowl and a half-game of good quarterbacking (before getting hurt) on the road against Pittsburgh. Brady had to earn his playoff reputation, which he has done over and over and over. People out there who doubt Brady just make themselves look foolish, acting as though what he has accomplished is due to the defense he plays with. But looking back through history, all dominant postseason teams, be they those with Bradshaw, Montana, Aikman, et al, have had top-notch defenses. Look at what's happened to Peyton Manning: he puts up all the numbers and wins in the regular season, but he simply cannot win in the playoffs against good teams. But Brady? He punches the vaunted Steelers defense right in the mouth with a 60-yard bomb on the first play off of a Bettis turnover yesterday, shutting up the Heinz Field crowd and also all the idiot football "analysts" who once again picked the Patriots to lose. Big-game quarterbacks make plays like that; non-big-game QB's do not (see Manning, Peyton and Pennington, Chad).

[/ QUOTE ]


The first year he won the SB, the 1.5 games played b4 are not considered "big games" any more than they are for Manning. THe point was, here was a seemingly solid, mostly untested QB playing against a dominant Rams team and a QB who had won 5 straight playoff games, 2 NFL MVP's, and a SB MVP, and he won the game.

The pistons last year played a more talented, well-coached(supposedly, not a Jackson fan), and WAY more "big game experience" team, and they smoked them. THe first year Jordan won, he was playing a Lakers team that had won 5 of the previous 9 titles, and the bulls won with ZERO finals experience. There are numerous instances of this in sports.

Again, I'll reiterate. I LIKE Brady as a player. I COnsider him a TOp 5 QB right now, but the Canton canonization is somewhat premature, as is the talk of him being among the best ever. Why is Bradshaw never mentioned among the best ever? Why not Aikman? Few have as impressive resumes as them, yet they are NEVER mentioned among best ever. Marino's place among the best ever suffers only slightly from not ever winning the big one. Brady will likely get to Canton easily,(I'm fairly certain there isn't a QB with 2 SB wins that isn't in that's been eligible), but this best now/among the best of all time is crap, and he'd be the first to tell you that.

Now, Belichick...Lombardi is looking over his shoulder...

[Lazymeatball]

I don't know if Big Game Experience (BGE) is a serious intangible to be taken into consideration or not, but I do know Daliman's argument against it is crappy and anecdotal.

One could make the argument that BGE is a helpful factor, but is not the sole factor in deciding football games. In that case, one could argue that Warner's prior BGE helped him get his team back to the Superbowl, and that had he lacked BGE, the Rams loss would have been worse than it was. Seriously though, the Rams blow, and Kurt Warner sucks. Also, seasoned veterans aren't created in a lab, they have to start of getting BGE somewhere, and the 2001 season is where Brady started. Now he's got it, and he's absolutely stunning in Big Games.

As fas ar as Tom Brady getting his ass kissed by everyone, people bandwagon onto guys that win lots and lots of football games. Coincidentally, guys who win lots and lots of football games go to the Hall of Fame. If Brady wins his third Superbowl in 4 years, in the current age of free agency, salary cap, and overall parody in the NFL, he deserves to go to the hall of fame.
I don't know how anyone can make comparisons of QB's between different eras because stats are subjective based on the opposing players in the league at that era. You can only compare how a QB does compared to his other contemporaries. So I agree that you can't determine him to be one of the best of all time, merely because I don't think you can determine any QB to be the best of all time.

[Daliman]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't know if Big Game Experience (BGE) is a serious intangible to be taken into consideration or not, but I do know Daliman's argument against it is crappy and anecdotal.


[/ QUOTE ]

Only because I don;t care to hash it out in every case used over the last 35 years. Believe me, it's overrated in and of itself. BGE is usually used as a major reason why teams win, but it's more the fact that they are a great team that they HAVE BGE, and therefore BGE is strictly a byproduct.

[ QUOTE ]
Seriously though, the Rams blow, and Kurt Warner sucks.

[/ QUOTE ]
They didn;t then, although i always said Warner was playing over his head and benefitting greatly form the system

Minor nit here though, this ALWAYS annoys me.
[ QUOTE ]
and overall parody in the NFL

[/ QUOTE ]

parody

n 1: a composition that imitates somebody's style in a humorous way [syn: lampoon, spoof, sendup, mockery, takeoff, burlesque, travesty, charade, pasquinade, put-on] 2: humorous or satirical mimicry [syn: mockery, takeoff] v 1: make a spoof of or make fun of 2: make a parody of; "The students spoofed the teachers" [syn: spoof, burlesque]

par·i·ty

n. pl. par·i·ties

1. Equality, as in amount, status, or value.
2. Functional equivalence, as in the weaponry or military strength of adversaries: “A problem that has troubled the U.S.-Soviet relationship from the beginning has been the issue of parity” (Charles William Maynes).
3. The equivalent in value of a sum of money expressed in terms of a different currency at a fixed official rate of exchange.
4. Equality of prices of goods or securities in two different markets.
5. A level for farm-product prices maintained by governmental support and intended to give farmers the same purchasing power they had during a chosen base period.

Parody is, strangely enough a bit of a parody of the word parity

[Lazymeatball]

[ QUOTE ]
BGE is usually used as a major reason why teams win, but it's more the fact that they are a great team that they HAVE BGE, and therefore BGE is strictly a byproduct.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, I defintiely agree with that, as that is the answet that makes the most sense of everything. Dumb sports analysts really suck when it comes to analyzing cause and effect. Like when they say such and such a team is 12-5 when scoring first, no [censored], they have more points already, of course they are more likely to win. Or this team has such and such a winning record when QB throws for 4 TD passes, i think you get the idea.


Oh, and thanks for the minor nit. I have never read the word parity, only heard it spoken. I learned something today.

[lastchance]

And you know what?

It doesn't matter how good Brady is. It only matters how good the Patriots are, and they are great.

Look, the Eagles are a very good team, but so are the Colts and Steelers. The Patriots are playing on entirely a different level.

The Patriots will jump out to an early lead, and every time the Eagles think about clawing back into the game, the Patriots will respond with a great play to shut them out.

[Daliman]

[ QUOTE ]
And you know what?

It doesn't matter how good Brady is. It only matters how good the Patriots are, and they are great.

Look, the Eagles are a very good team, but so are the Colts and Steelers. The Patriots are playing on entirely a different level.

The Patriots will jump out to an early lead, and every time the Eagles think about clawing back into the game, the Patriots will respond with a great play to shut them out.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. MAN i wish TO was 100%, would be SUCH anawesome game then, mebbe the best overall talent/skill ever, up there with SF/Miami.