Party's Bonus Bonanza

[WSOPWinner2005]

Anyone realize how much bonus money party has paid out lately? I have literally $675 in cleared bonuses since 12/17/04 at Party Poker - once I clear the $200 bonus I just deposited and got tonight. Which should be Sunday (I have a busy weekend and REALLY not in the mood to play tonight to be honest)

Over $650 in a month pretty much, then Baulucka's post about buying bonuses ? I think party is hurting from the serious players who play 4 - 8 tables who got their start at party, learned about rakeback, and kicked over to sites that openly offer Rake Back (when setup properly of course).

So now party says, O.K. We will open up that game and let you pay out under us as well. They start this agressively after they see the impact empire has had on them. They realize that players are staying at the second site they signed up for to get the rake back and use their party accounts for bonuses only.

So, what is a logical way to solve this problem for party ?

Fire away, I have my own ideas but I'm not posting them. If you feel like airing yours in public feel free. I will state this much, I think Baulucky's idea is bad for the site, but will increase competition amongst the sites.

Bottom line is there is only one simple answer I can think of : Party takes this damn rewards program they offer and set it up as a 30% rake kickback and do not charge affiliates for it if the player generates over say $5,000 a month in Total Rake, if they don't provide that much rake than they (the affiliate) has to pay a certain percentage of the 30% kick back.

Affiliates are probably screaming "BLOODY MURDER" - But what they don't realize is ALOT of people (I would venture 60% of SERIOUS players playing at party that do more than clear bonuses) have a rake back elsewhere. If they are offered 30% on top of any rake back deal you may have with them they are set AND will play more - hopefully including the fish to level out the efect of multi tablers.

Hell if you quit offering rake abck and just the 30% goes to us - we are still happy (But we try to get half of the affiliates income of course and an affiliate war would be set to be written in the history books)

Also what are people's thoughts on the proper amount of tables each party skin should allow, and whether changes here would impact the level of multi tablers to average joe's ? I think a devoted player will just 10 table across 5 sites if he really wants to, just wanted to see what others thoughts were on this ..

Thoughts?

[WSOPWinner2005]

Of course for this to be profitable to party, a minimum number of hands would be required (or rake) to be in this 'elite' club - no less than $5,000 in rake a month for the first level paying out say 15% - 20% and so on from there...

[detroitplayer]

I have a question about reload bonuses... does one have to bring their account down to zero to qualify? IE, if I have $500 in party, and they start a reload bonus, do I have to cash out the $500 first, and then re-deposit, or do I just have to add more money to my existing account?

This is just a general question for how all sites work, not just party.

[WSOPWinner2005]

Doesn't matter, u could have $3,000,000 and get the deposit bonus or $0

[detroitplayer]

Thanks for the info. Seemed strange to me because I don't understand how giving free money to people who already have their rolls in play and are playing is profitable? Or is it just because of the possible increase in play by people trying to clear?

Also, lets say someone has $500 in party, and that is all they have set aside for their roll and dind't have (or want to) put anymore in play... could they cash out and redeposit?

[WSOPWinner2005]

Those aren't deposit bonuses - those are cashout restricted bonuses.. big difference..

cashout bonuses cash put in players account to play with right away

deposit bonus must clear X hands before you get the money

[detroitplayer]

What are you talking about? What's a cashout bonus?

The only thing I am talking about are bonuses that require deposits to be made and hands to be played to clear the bonus.

[WSOPWinner2005]

I'm suprised noone has anything at all to say here.... ???

As defined by Webster's dictionary...

Cashout restricted bonus : Money is applied to your poker account at the site you are playing with under the assumption you will play the required number of hands they request. If you do not complete the hands in time they remove the money from your account. There are discrepencies as to whether they will remove the amount from future deposits if the bonus period passed and the WR were not met. Also if you have a bonus such as this for $100 you will not be able to cashout leaving LESS than $100 in your account until the WR are met

Deposit Bonus - you deposit money & have to play a certain # of hands prior to having the bonus released, once released it is your money cashout do whatever you want with it.

[J_B]

On party, can I withdraw all the $$$ from my account and then redeposit to get the bonus? Or is that a big nono?

Thanks,
JB

[J_B]

qactually, think you guys answered it after reading more// too tired

[FishBurger]

[ QUOTE ]
So now party says, O.K. We will open up that game and let you pay out under us as well. They start this agressively after they see the impact empire has had on them. They realize that players are staying at the second site they signed up for to get the rake back and use their party accounts for bonuses only.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm confused. Empire is a "Party" skin, right? So each different "Party skin" is run by a different company? What is the overall business model? Does one company own the software, host all the players, and lease out the software for customization to the "skin" companies? Do the "skin" companies then compete with each other for players?

[Benholio]

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for the info. Seemed strange to me because I don't understand how giving free money to people who already have their rolls in play and are playing is profitable? Or is it just because of the possible increase in play by people trying to clear?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, having a few million extra dollars laying around can be pretty valuable to a company that knows how to use it.

[cbfair]

OK, I'll bite...

I said I agree with you completely in the other thread, this was based on my understanding of a simple modification to Baulucky's plan you proposed over there.

I don't think his plan is inherently bad, I just think that as he originally stated it, it will encourage better players to play ALOT more and multi table ALOT more to clear the huge number of hands required. This is the opposite of what we all want which is more soft players buying into the tables we play at.

I don't know the details of how this would have to work, but I think Party/skins ought to find new ways to infuse capital at the bottom of the system to keep the whole thing afloat for the long term. We all know that in poker, cash always flows from the weakest players at the low levels to the strongest players at the top levels. Any program that rewards players at the middle-to-higher levels (3/6 and up in this case) automatically cuts out those who need the money most and do the most to "feed" the whole system.

An inexpensive "bonus coupon" that releases a larger bonus (like $1000) in measured increments will allow weak players to keep playing for very long periods of time while providing no real incentive for them to improve their play. Imagine how much rake Party could take off of low stakes tables if fish were infinitely supplied with cash... The real benefit is that it encourages multi tablers to hone their games and then take their bankrolls to the higher limits, some will be strong players and others will become the new fish in town.

These "super-bonuses" are like a long term investment that grows in value over time. Party would likely make more in rake than the bonus amount while it was initially cleared, but when the bonus is released, this allows losing players to keep playing and generating rake. It also encourages more multitablers (who generate up to 4x the rake) to come in and feed on the fish or be eaten themselves. Everybody wins...

Any thoughts?

Oh, to reiterate to Baulucky, I think his initial idea of a pre-paid "bonus coupon" is really great and I'm glad he suggested it. I just think it can stand some tweaking - the concept remains the same, its only a modified implementation that I'm supporting here.

[detroitplayer]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm suprised noone has anything at all to say here.... ???

As defined by Webster's dictionary...

Cashout restricted bonus : Money is applied to your poker account at the site you are playing with under the assumption you will play the required number of hands they request. If you do not complete the hands in time they remove the money from your account. There are discrepencies as to whether they will remove the amount from future deposits if the bonus period passed and the WR were not met. Also if you have a bonus such as this for $100 you will not be able to cashout leaving LESS than $100 in your account until the WR are met

Deposit Bonus - you deposit money & have to play a certain # of hands prior to having the bonus released, once released it is your money cashout do whatever you want with it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, I understand the differences in both. However, they are both similar. You can't cash out the money until you've cleared the hands. Great.

I learn something new every day, however, I still don't understand what that has to do with anything I've previously posted in this thread.

I was only curious as to whether reload bonuses were offered to players who still had their rolls in play and were still actively playing.

For instance, if I leave my phone carrier, they will call me back 2 weeks later and offer me a great deal to switch my service back over with them. They do this because I am no longer their customer and in order to get me back, they offer up a good deal. They do not offer the same deal to the people who already have their phone service. And why should they? They already have their business.

That is why I was wondering if the reload bonuses were only good for people who had $0 balances (ie, cancelled the service - and the bonus was to try to "get them back") and if people who already had money in the account ("still current customers") were eligible too.

[BradleyT]

[ QUOTE ]

I'm confused. Empire is a "Party" skin, right? So each different "Party skin" is run by a different company? What is the overall business model? Does one company own the software, host all the players, and lease out the software for customization to the "skin" companies? Do the "skin" companies then compete with each other for players?

[/ QUOTE ]

Pretty much. I'm not sure about the licensing details but they probably pay a small lease fee to Party and a small percentage of the rake.