Home Tourney Controversy. Please help.

[Tenacious A]

I run a monthly NLHE tournament. A portion of each month’s buy in goes into a prize pool. We have 6 month seasons. Points are awarded for finishing in the top 8 each week. Top eight and ties at end of the season get to play in the Points Championship Tournament (PCT) for the money that has accumulated in the prize pool.

I busted out early and handed the tournament director role over to Steve, a regular player who knows the rules.

When it was down to four players, Steve told Josh, the chip leader, that his 11 points would be good enough to get him in the PCT. Soon afterward, the other big stack moved in with AK. Josh called with QQ, lost and with only 250 chips left was soon out of the tournament. The smallest stack had barely enough to cover the small blind, and would have likely been out after one more orbit.

Steve miscalculated and Josh’s 11 points left him one point short of qualifying for the PCT. Josh claims (and I believe him) that he would have laid down QQ, and let the short stack bust out. This move would have not only made him more money last night, but would have also given him the extra point he needed to tie for the 8th spot.

So, do I rule that the player is ultimately responsible for himself, and must track points on his own, leaving Josh out, or that Josh should be allowed in as the ninth player, because he based his play on information supplied by the acting tournament director that he took to be fact?

Thanks.

[smoore]

When the TD speaks, it's the voice of god... I say you should let him play because he was giving erroneous information. I would clear it with the other participants but I wouldn't "ask"... I'd just state what I was doing and see if anyone goes ballistic.

[Slow Play Ray]

Sounds like you just need to make an executive decision here. If you are all friends and noone has any serious objections, I would just let him in, as it sounds as though he probably deserves to be.

P.S. Steve is a meatball, and should never be put in charge of anything ever again.

[warewulf]

I would say he doesn't have enough points, doesn't qualify. You and your friend should try to be vague, not give definite answers. Should say things like: you'll "probably" qualify.

[Fins]

Eeewww... tough call. How many players vie for the PTC? How close was is 10th spot (i.e. next one back from Josh)? Would that be a typical laydown for Josh and did he inquire as to his standings? Do you (would you) change your play because of your PTC standings?

I'd feel the group out for objections and probably let him play... of course Steve would have to be the dedicated dealer or bar maid.

- Fins

[TheCroShow]

Why did he call then? Sounds like a chip dumping incident to me, and how the hell can you lay down pocket Queens?

[Stew]

[ QUOTE ]
Why did he call then? Sounds like a chip dumping incident to me, and how the hell can you lay down pocket Queens?

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you kidding me?

[TheCroShow]

no i am not kidding you. he thinks to himself "OOHH i'm in! no need to finish this game, oh my buddy went all in, i'll call..i have a great hand and could score some huge chips, if he has something better than me, then great he beats me and i'm still in...increasing his chances of a better finish.."

[Slow Play Ray]

[ QUOTE ]
no i am not kidding you. he thinks to himself "OOHH i'm in! no need to finish this game, oh my buddy went all in, i'll call..i have a great hand and could score some huge chips, if he has something better than me, then great he beats me and i'm still in...increasing his chances of a better finish.."

[/ QUOTE ]

But he had QQ...not like he did it w/ 23...

[Lottery Larry]

The player is responsible for their own results.

That said, whether in a friendly home game you want to make an exception... it might be a good idea (treat it as a tie?).

Beat Steve with wet noodles for an hour before the tourney starts.

[Lottery Larry]

I agree with the vagueness comment.

[Tenacious A]

[ QUOTE ]
How many players vie for the PTC?

[/ QUOTE ]
About 50 different players played over the course of the season.

[ QUOTE ]
How close was is 10th spot (i.e. next one back from Josh)?

[/ QUOTE ]

The 10th spot finished 1 behind Josh at 10 points.

[ QUOTE ]
Would that be a typical laydown for Josh and did he inquire as to his standings?

[/ QUOTE ]

Steve told me that both Josh and the other big stack, Bob, were very interested to know how they stood in the PTC race. In looking back, Bob had to have also been told that 11 points was enough to get in (had he busted with AK he would have been the bubble boy with 11 points). Bob definitely would have waited out the small stack had he known the reality of the points. And I do believe Josh would have laid it down. (The prize pool for that night's tournament was roughly the same as the prize pool for the PTC.)

[ QUOTE ]
of course Steve would have to be the dedicated dealer or bar maid.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's funny you say that, because I had told the host (since he didn't qualify for the PTC) that he would need to wear a skirt and serve cocktails, but clearly that would be a role Steve would be better suited for. Steve and I are very good friends and both just found 2+2 a few months ago, so he's very pleased that I posted this--before he's even posted out here he's been labeled a meatball, and a bar maid.

[Lottery Larry]

maybe a first time exception and have 10 players at the final table, due to bad information?

Tough call, but I'd go with the group-friendly decision over the strict rules interpretation, if that wouldn't disrupt the group too much.

Make a note- you need to do a better job getting the "points needed" info out there, more often.