Behold the power of A2s in EP

[GrunchCan]

This table has been running loose.

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
Hero calls, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP2 calls, <font color="#666666">5 folds</font>.

Flop: (5.50 SB) 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/club.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 folds, MP2 calls.

Turn: (4.25 BB) 2/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG+1 calls, MP2 folds.

River: (6.25 BB) J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG+1 calls.

Final Pot: 8.25 BB

The moral of the story: A2s ain't so bad!

[mr pink]

i still muck it UTG

[Entity]

WTF? Did BB open-fold preflop?

[GrunchCan]

It certianly can't be wrong to muck it, but I think there's value to be had at the right table.

[toss]

Maybe he got disconnected.

[GrunchCan]

not according to the history window. Looks like he open-folded. Isn't that kewl?

[Knoler]

[ QUOTE ]
It certianly can't be wrong to muck it, but I think there's value to be had at the right table.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd say the key is define "running loose." Of course, no guarantees if you're UTG, but if the table is generally 5+ to the flop, mostly unraised (not totally unheard of at lower limits, but does this really happen lots at 2/4?) then I'd limp.

But generally, I like to see a limper or two first.

That aside, nice hand.
-Brian

[Hack]

I agree with Fonzie.

Damn I like saying that.

[kiemo]

[ QUOTE ]
WTF? Did BB open-fold preflop?

[/ QUOTE ]

Its an advanced table image play rooted in the third level of thinking.

[frank_iii]

[ QUOTE ]
i still muck it UTG

[/ QUOTE ]

The common thinking in small stakes seems to be that, if you can't limp UTG with small pairs and AXs, then you need to find another table. I think that's even more appropriate in micro.

Not that it means much (especially with sample size issues for individual hands), but I show a profit with all AXs in general and from nearly all positions.

[jskills]

Only if you can somehow make two pair or a flush. And how often will you be beaten by another Ace or smaller pair when that doesn't happen?

[LittleLew]

Being new to PT, this forum and HE (3 days, 1 week, 6 months - in that order) I have my trepidations about posting, but I just looked at the 3k hands I have in PT and I show a profit at micro-limits with most A and suited small x.

So there, I am no longer a 2+2 virgin!

[GrunchCan]

Welcome to the forum.

Post some hands.

[GrunchCan]

We could very reliably get 6 players to the flop, and only 1 pot in 5 were raised PF. It was a great table.

[frank_iii]

[ QUOTE ]
Only if you can somehow make two pair or a flush. And how often will you be beaten by another Ace or smaller pair when that doesn't happen?

[/ QUOTE ]

How much will you win when you do? I think you may be underestimating the value of top pair.

[GrunchCan]

True, A2 is easily dominated by another A, but that doesn't mean if an A falls on the board one of your opponent has one. In fact, I'd say that very often, they don't. Although results are irrelevant, that is in fact what happened in this case. My opponent turned over something like QT, and MHIG. This is very common at this level.

Hence, this post to begin with. I think that many microers tend to undervalue the top-pair strength of Axs. I'm not saying it's a powerhouse, but it's not chopped liver, either.

[Knoler]

[ QUOTE ]
We could very reliably get 6 players to the flop, and only 1 pot in 5 were raised PF. It was a great table.

[/ QUOTE ]

Those kinds of tables give me warm fuzzy feelings, right there in the cockles of my heart.

Regards,
-Brian

[SoftcoreRevolt]

The same logic holds when betting AXs as when betting TPTK on a board where trips is possible. While it isn't as profitable as a better kicker, it is still slightly profitable, especially with too many people seeing the flop.

[KingOtter]

[ QUOTE ]
True, A2 is easily dominated by another A, but that doesn't mean if an A falls on the board one of your opponent has one. In fact, I'd say that very often, they don't. Although results are irrelevant, that is in fact what happened in this case. My opponent turned over something like QT, and MHIG. This is very common at this level.

Hence, this post to begin with. I think that many microers tend to undervalue the top-pair strength of Axs. I'm not saying it's a powerhouse, but it's not chopped liver, either.

[/ QUOTE ]

And I might even predict as you move up in stakes, the less chance your opponent will be keeping that Ace-rag around like they love to do in lower stakes, giving it some added value.

KO

[GrunchCan]

Well, maybe so. But if that's true, then I have to keep going up, becasue they sure as hell are playing rags at 2/4.

[Knoler]

[ QUOTE ]
Well, maybe so. But if that's true, then I have to keep going up, becasue they sure as hell are playing rags at 2/4.

[/ QUOTE ]

You and I really need to have a chat about 2/4 table selection, because I seem to have issues to work out.

-B

[frank_iii]

Grunch, perhaps you're just remembering the times you lose to a better kicker rather than the times you lead out the flop and everyone folds...I think that's sometimes our nature to dwell on the bad.

EDIT: Actually, I don't know who I'm responding to...we seem to be in agreement on top pair value. Anyway, it's early.

[GrunchCan]

I think we are in agreement. I like Axs. Table selection is the key.