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View Full Version : Party 15/30 -- when to raise?


William Jockusch
01-11-2005, 05:07 PM
Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is CO with T/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif. Hero posts a blind of $15.
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, Hero (poster) calls, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds.

Flop: (5.66 SB) 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.83 BB) T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (6.83 BB) Q/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, UTG calls.

Final Pot: 10.83 BB

The question that most interests me with this hand is: Should I have raised the turn? Or was it correct to wait until the river? And why?

CheckFold
01-11-2005, 05:44 PM
I'd raise the turn because he may well 3-bet AK and then you can 4 bet and still likely get paid off. He's much less likely to 3 bet the river.

elindauer
01-11-2005, 06:05 PM
You have your opponent crushed and drawing to very few outs. Do whatever you need to do to hit him for the maximum. Against a really aggressive opponent who could be on a total steal, call, raise the river to give him a chance to keep bluffing. Against a really tight player, call, in the hopes he'll pay off with JJ on the river. Against your typical 15/30 player, raise the turn because he'll call you down with KK but will check the river costing you a bet, not mention the chance of his 3-betting AK.

Just some quick thoughts.
Eric

mplspoker
01-11-2005, 06:15 PM
My opinion is definitely raise the turn, b/c you need to protect your hand, you really don't know if he has flush draw, ak, jj-kk whatever, you need to raise turn and get paid, if he folds fine, but nobody is folding AK in that spot on party......

BusterStacks
01-11-2005, 08:06 PM
Absolutely raise the turn, can you think of a reason NOT to?

William Jockusch
01-11-2005, 08:29 PM
Buster: I can think of a reason not to. If UTG is bluffing, I want him to continue his bluff.

That said, my feeling at that point was that he wasn't bluffing, and his most likely hand was AK. And I tend to agree with the poster who said that by raising the turn, I stand a chance of collecting two additional bets from AK.

By waiting until the river, I lowered my chance of that, as there are more ways AK can be beat, so it is less likely to 3-bet. Furthermore, with the actual river card, I would have been unable to 4-bet, because I would have been concerned that I was now losing to AQ.

All that said, I still need to do some more thinking about this type of situation. It is clear to me that in some situations like this, it is correct to raise the turn, and in others it is correct to wait until the river. I need a way to tell these situations apart.