Is the "flop to river" column in the odds chart useless?

[teddyFBI]

I got into a discussion with my friend yesterday about odds chart, and I was telling him that I thought that the column of the odds chart that tells you what the odds are on the FLOP that you'll make your hand by the river (i.e. 2 cards to come) was essentially useless.

Am I wrong? I've always thought that it was more accurate to simply use the "flop to turn" column when deciding whether to call a flop bet, and the "turn to river" column for a turn bet...in fact, I think that it's even misleading to consider the "flop to river" column, because the landscape can change so drastically on the turn -- isn't it best to think of things in terms of 2 distinct and separate decision points, rather than a single decision point with 2 cards to come??

I suppose that knowing that your OESD or 4-flush on the flop will come in approximately 1/3 of the time by the river is a handy tidbit to know, but when (if ever) is it really useful to consider the flop to river column in an odds chart?

Thanks

[IsaacW]

[ QUOTE ]
I suppose that knowing that your OESD or 4-flush on the flop will come in approximately 1/3 of the time by the river is a handy tidbit to know, but when (if ever) is it really useful to consider the flop to river column in an odds chart?

[/ QUOTE ]
This is useful when deciding whether to bet or raise your draw on the flop. For example, with a 4-flush on the flop you will complete your flush approximately 35% of the time by the river. Let's say you are on the button with this hand and there are 4 people acting in front of you. If it is checked to you, you should bet because you will make your hand (and probably win) 35% of the time but you are only putting 20% of the money in if everyone calls. You are said to have a "pot equity" edge in this situation and should bet.

Under the same conditions, if someone in early position bets and everyone calls to you, you should often raise for the same reason. Your flush draw makes money on every additional bet that goes into the pot on the flop round because you will make your hand so often.

[Lost Wages]

For one, it lets you know when you can value bet or raise a draw on the flop.

The other time it is useful is in no-limit tournaments (and sometimes cash games) where you will frequently be all-in on the flop.

Lost Wages

[bholdr]

Isacc pretty much hit the nail on the head, but there are a couple of other uses for those odds as given. first, for most situations, you may simply cut those odds in half to get a fair approximation of the odds of hitting on the next card. unless the descision is really close, that's a good enough rule. of course it's better o have the real odds, but it's pretty close.

second, if you are playing big bet poker, and somebody moves all in after the flop with their last 100$ into a 300$ pot, you can fairly say thet the pot-odds (since they are laying 4-1 on a call, for a flush, a 1.8-1 draw) justify a call.