A turn twist

[antidan444]

Two questions here:

1. I raised the flop to protect my very vulnerable (to say the least) top pair. Smart or foolish?

2. Counting my turn outs proved ... interesting. I could be drawing dead, or if hell were to freeze over I could have as many 10 (two 8s, one 5, four 6s, three 7s). I know I don't have a full 10 (especially the ones that are spades), but trying to discount all my outs was quite a task. Eventually, I threw my hands up, said, "That's a big honking pot thar!" and called praying for a miracle.

Oh yeah ... this was a super-fishy table, assume all are sprouting fins out of their backs.

Thoughts?

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero calls, CO calls, Button calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB checks.

Flop: (7.50 SB) 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 5/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(7 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG checks, UTG+2 checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, CO calls, Button calls, BB calls, UTG folds, UTG+2 folds, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 3-bets</font>, Hero calls, CO calls, Button calls, BB calls.

Turn: (11.25 BB) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, MP1 calls, Hero calls, CO calls, Button folds.

River: (15.25 BB) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, MP1 folds, Hero folds ...

[bennyk]

Did you think that the T /images/graemlins/spade.gif completed villain's hand?

It seems like if the size of the pot vs. your chances of having the best hand convinced you to call the turn bet, the T /images/graemlins/spade.gif doesn't seem very scary. Villain may have backed into a flush, but if you felt committed on the turn, I think you should have called.

I give you about 5 outs on the turn, and you're only getting 6:1 on the turn call. I don't mind a fold on the turn (I actually LIKE a fold on the turn), but I don't think folding the river is good.

bk

[antidan444]

I think I'm actually getting like 11:1 on the turn call.

Reflecting on the river fold with such a large pot, I did blank mentally in that I didn't really think much about it at that point. I saw four spades, an overcard and the possibility he could have trips, and threw it away.

[Hojglad]

You are behind on the flop. Call re-raise, fold the turn when bet into (unless you fill up, of course).

You are behind on the turn. Fold.

You are behind on the river. Good fold.

Unless hell froze over, it looks like the BB made his flush on the turn. Why else would you cold call a raise, then call a re-raise, and then proceed to bet out on the turn when the third suited card comes?

The pot may have been big, but your equity was VERY low.

MP1 had trips, BB has a flush.

[antidan444]

Against this field, a bet into me on the flop does not mean I'm already beat. There's no way I'm folding this for one bet on the flop. Maybe I call instead of raise, and I probably fold facing two cold, but not one.

[ChoicestHops]

If your low-suited cards dont make a draw on the flop, you fold. Bad play on every round.

[Shillx]

You either have 2 outs or 4 outs. I'm not sure exactly how many...

Thank hand is probably fine though.

Brad

[rabman]

I've read all the other responses and my line is fold preflop. I wouldn't play this hand from MP. I might call from LP. It is hands like this that get you into trouble. If the flop doesn't smack you in the face fold it.

[antidan444]

Once three players are already in, I think this is a pretty simple preflop call that is profitable provided you play well postflop.

Of course, lots of what happened in this hand postflop is debatable, and folding it preflop isn't exactly a huge -EV play, either.

[Kenrick]

I don't mind the flop raise, but when the bb coldcalls and then bets out on the flush card, I'll give him credit for it. Not much else he could be coldcalling with.