Big Hand, Curious on it [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

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Jurollo

12-28-2004, 03:31 AM

Ok so if I was results oriented I would do this everytime but I thought for sure I was up against AA, KK, or TT, but thought the shear size of this pot made it worthwhile to stick around, thought one of the players did have AT and one on a flush draw, and was right, but surprise to see the other had JJ. Overall is this bad or is the pot lying me good enough odds to stick around till showdown?

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with Q/images/graemlins/club.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG folds, Hero raises, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button calls, SB 3-bets, BB calls, Hero caps, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: (24 SB) 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif (6 players)
SB bets, BB raises, Hero calls, MP1 calls, MP2 3-bets, Button calls, SB caps, BB calls, Hero calls, MP1 folds, Button calls.

Turn: (22.50 BB) 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif (5 players)
SB bets, BB calls, Hero calls, Button calls.

River: (26.50 BB) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif (5 players)
SB bets, BB calls, Hero calls, Button calls.

Final Pot: 30.50 BB
Main Pot: 30.50 BB, between SB, BB, Hero, MP2 and Button. > Pot won by Hero (30.50 BB).

Results in white below: 
SB has 7d Ad (high card, ace).
BB has Ah Td (one pair, tens).
Hero has Qc Qs (one pair, queens).
MP2 has Jd Jh (one pair, jacks).
Button has Ts As (one pair, tens).
Outcome: Hero wins 30.50 BB.

Russ McGinley

12-28-2004, 04:28 AM

Looks standard. All that betting by the SB has to make you slow down, despite the fact that he got to show down ace-high. That's what notes are for!

Jurollo

12-28-2004, 04:33 AM

Thanks for the reply Russ, yea I thought there was too much there to lay it down, even thought I would say I thought it was 75% for someone to show KK or AA and maybe 50% that in addition to the KK or AA someone had hit a set... although the non raised turn, gave me hope, if the turn gets raised or 3-bet I might have left, but i stayed in for 1 bet there. Any more thoughts anyone?
~Justin

Shillx

12-28-2004, 04:33 AM

Big pots are not the time to "fear the worst". Save this thinking for small pots.

Calling the flop is fine if you plan on raising the turn. 3-betting the flop also looks like a fine line as well. Invest that extra bet or 2, and if you crash, so be it.

Brad

asdf1234

12-28-2004, 05:06 AM

I think I'd 3-bet the flop.

Jurollo

12-28-2004, 03:30 PM

The flop was already capped.. you mean the turn?
~Justin

Harv72b

12-28-2004, 03:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The flop was already capped.. you mean the turn?
~Justin

[/ QUOTE ]

He called 2 cold twice on the flop. What they meant (and I agree) is that Hero should have 3-bet the first time around. With the size of the pot you're not going to force out a diamond draw, but forcing the next 3 players to call 3 is a good way to get rid of some overcards.

When the flop got capped, the pot is so big now that I doubt a turn raise forces anyone out who would've called 1 bet, so that, combined with the very likely read that SB is on AA or KK, makes calling down a perfectly reasonable play.

Milky

12-28-2004, 06:38 PM

I lean towards 3-betting the flop myself but calling is probably okay too. The rest looks good.

Jurollo

12-28-2004, 07:09 PM

Thank you everyone. I appreciate the help.
~Justin

SomethingClever

12-28-2004, 07:49 PM

Easy calldown on the turn and river, IMO.

The Goober

12-28-2004, 07:57 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Big pots are not the time to "fear the worst". Save this thinking for small pots.

Calling the flop is fine if you plan on raising the turn. 3-betting the flop also looks like a fine line as well. Invest that extra bet or 2, and if you crash, so be it.

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

IMHO not 3-betting the flop is criminal. The pot isn't "big", it's "friggin' huge" and if you wait for the turn its unlikely that the action will give you another chance to face the field with calling 3 cold.

BottlesOf

12-28-2004, 08:47 PM

I think this is fine. A flop 3-bet may be the difference between a call and a fold for the MPs/Button--something to consider.