Saying bye-bye to Poker Tracker. (Long and sappy).

[Benman]

Poker Tracker has been very helpful to me at low limits. It's showed me some holes in my game that I've been able to fix. Unfortunately, however, it's also become a crutch. Instead of paying careful attention to the game in front of me, I've come to rely too much on exported PT notes. The trade-off hasn't been worth it. And there are other drawbacks. I obsess about my win rate, instead of about the quality of my play. I'll quit a session early because I don't want my win rate as reflected in PT to drop from x to x minus .003 BB/100. Another big problem--I haven't branched out to play games other than hold'em because I can't follow the results in Poker Tracker. Bottom line, as helpful as the software is in some respects, it's holding me back. I know that's heretical to some on this forum (previously to me too), but to each his own. So, where to go from here? I'm giving up PT cold turkey. I'm going to single table ring games of all types and learn as much as I can about games other than hold'em, while still playing hold'em, my main game. I'm going to focus entirely on the game in front of me--who's doing what, how they're running, and so forth. I think this is the next step on my poker "journey." I feel very good about it. Please flame away if you feel the need to. I'm in a happy place.

[memphis57]

What's your user name? I want to mark my PT notes on you that you don't use PT.

[Cardzy]

[ QUOTE ]
What's your user name? I want to mark my PT notes on you that you don't use PT.

[/ QUOTE ]

ROFL!

Good luck to ya Benman. Hope it does what your hoping for you.

[Bacchus]

Rather than flame away, I'll say that I respect your decision. It sounds like you're looking for some balance--less focus on the technical aspects of the game and more focus on playing for fun. Nothing wrong with that.

[QuickLearner]

Your post wasn't sappy. Except for the "happy place" part... /images/graemlins/grin.gif

Seriously, I'd rather go without Pokertracker than 2+2. But why quit cold turkey? Just don't play with the gametime windows or import hand histories until after a session. It's still a fascinating tool and the best record keeper you could ask for.

[joedot]

Pokertracker is overrated. Just like a lot of these 17 year olds joining the NBA. I won a lot of money at online poker before getting pokertracker. Chip Reese and Doyle Brunson made millions off poker, and I'm pretty sure neither one of them ever used pokertracker. Too many people on this site are obsessed over it, and I don't see the reason why. When I sit at a table it doesn't take me more than a couple minutes to find the guy that is playing every hand, or the guy turning over 38 offsuit that he limped in with from mp. I don't need some database to tell me that. So, kudos to you, and may you enjoy continued poker success.

[SlowStroke]

I quit using PT also.

For me what is important is how opponents are playing right now - not how they played yesterday.

I found that I gave too much emphasis to the PT stats and was missing what was right in front of my eyes.

[soko]

I am about to get pokertracker, but I plan on using it to review my hands and fix holes, I am not too worried about checking my opponents stats because you can usually do that stuff in your head roughly. Anyways, if you don't want pokertracker how about you just give me your reg key so I dont hae to pay /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[stinkypete]

[ QUOTE ]
For me what is important is how opponents are playing right now - not how they played yesterday.


[/ QUOTE ]

in that case, get rid of the stats from previous sessions...

once you get about 30 hands into a session, some PT stats start to become useful (VP$IP very much so, PFR as well).

[Leo Bello]

Poker Tracker is a very useful tool. maybe u could try not looking at it during the sessions. U can try to get a feel playing the tables without PT and in the end review your play

[Grisgra]

[ QUOTE ]
Another big problem--I haven't branched out to play games other than hold'em because I can't follow the results in Poker Tracker.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is one of the reasons I haven't tried learning 7-stud Hi-Lo . . .

I find that at the SH table I really benefit from the insta-reads I get using PT, but hey, I might be relying on it too much. I've caught a disturbing number of "passive" players with low aggression scores bluffing, something I never would have expected -- it's possible that PT has cost me some money here and there, I dunno.

I think you'd probably be better off adjusting to using it better than you do now (are you REALLY not going to worry about win-rate without PT?), but good luck anyhow!

[Dave H.]

So have you all responded to this Poll (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=1430229&page=3&view=c ollapsed&sb=5&o=14&fpart=1) ?

[Rudbaeck]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Another big problem--I haven't branched out to play games other than hold'em because I can't follow the results in Poker Tracker.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is one of the reasons I haven't tried learning 7-stud Hi-Lo . . .

[/ QUOTE ]

I haven't bothered diving into the nitty gritty of either vanilla 7cs or 7cs hi/lo due to the obvious limitations on multitabling.

Sometimes I wonder if the fish will abandon flop games eventually.

[daryn]

i use pokertracker, but i don't use it to track other players' play, i just use it to track myself mainly. i know who the fish are and aren't just by watching a little.

[traputillucry]

Amen, That thing is junk why not do it the real way in your head if your going to do it I hate all the talk about this lame software just another way to make money off poker players. people that need it to play cant play poker with out it adventually it becomes a handy cap over time.. /images/graemlins/blush.gif

[pudley4]

[ QUOTE ]
Amen, That thing is junk why not do it the real way in your head if your going to do it I hate all the talk about this lame software just another way to make money off poker players. people that need it to play cant play poker with out it adventually it becomes a handy cap over time.. /images/graemlins/blush.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I hate finding new ways to make money off poker players...
http://www.ina-community.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[stoxtrader]

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Pokertracker is overrated.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this possible?

[k_squared]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Amen, That thing is junk why not do it the real way in your head if your going to do it I hate all the talk about this lame software just another way to make money off poker players. people that need it to play cant play poker with out it adventually it becomes a handy cap over time.. /images/graemlins/blush.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I hate finding new ways to make money off poker players...
http://www.ina-community.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

lol...

If you become 'dependent' upon the poker trakcer that is not a problem with the poker tracker. It is a tool and how you use it (whether profitably or not) reflects on you and not the tool. It is a good resource for providing you with information on a huge field of players that you might otherwise have no information on. The information is obviously subordinate to how you are seeing them play right now, but that does not make the information useless. Don't stop using it, just stop relying on it or focusing on the wrong things... Don't get rid of a huge resource for learning about opponents and most importantly yourself!

-K_squared

[jedi]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Pokertracker is overrated.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this possible?

[/ QUOTE ]

If it cost about $500 more, yes. However I find it to be a bargain at the old price, and still a bargain even at the current price. It's helped me patch up some leaks and though I don't use it as much as I used to, it's still a valuable tool when I go back and look at some leaks that I have.

[Nottom]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Pokertracker is overrated.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this possible?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd agree that its overrated.

Of course thats only because so many people on here make it sound like if you don't have pokertracker you are going to be a big loser and that just owning PT will add 2BB/100 to your winrate.

Its an excellent tool and I would recommend it to anybody who is looking to improve their game but it's not the best thing since sliced bread like some people make it out to be.

[masterblaker]

I think statking is all you really need. It tracks your winrate and plenty of other things, like how big of a bankroll do you need. Like someone already said, I can track the fish in my head and also by using the 'note' feature on the site I play. One thing I don't like about pokertracker is that my computer is probably not big enough to use it effectively. Maybe one day I will start using pokertracker, if I get a better computer. But til then my winrate is plenty good without it. Just my opinion.

[Leavenfish]

[ QUOTE ]
Unfortunately, however, it's also become a crutch. Instead of paying careful attention to the game in front of me, I've come to rely too much on exported PT notes. The trade-off hasn't been worth it. And there are other drawbacks. I obsess about my win rate, instead of about the quality of my play. I'll quit a session early because I don't want my win rate as reflected in PT to drop from x to x minus .003 BB/100.

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay now everyone can flame away at me...but here are my thoughts: takes some of that money you have won using Poker Tracker and visit a psychiatrist. I'm serious.

Aside from wanting to branch out (nothing wrong there), the problems you list are entirely of your own making. Problems of some sort are surely going to manifest themselves and follow you wherever you go until you take a good long look at yourself and why you have been doing the things you have been doing.

No, I am not a psychiatrist and I do not play one of TV...but I'll bet every penny I have that I am right about this.

---Leavenfish

[Siawyn]

In all seriousness this sounds like a problem with you, not a problem with Poker Tracker. I use PT primarily to keep stats on myself, and to review problems hands, try to find a few leaks, and loosely identify top fishies and rocks. I still rely on my observations at the table though. PT just gives me a starting point going in, especially for those I see more than a few times.

As for it not supporting other games.. well, that's true. But how does it hold you back from playing them? Go play them anyways, and trust your reads then. You can still use PT to track your results at hold'em after all. As for worrying that your winrate dropped .003BB/100... that's all psychological. I got above a certain nice round number in one of my categories, and I admit, a little part of me didn't want it to drop below it. But so what? It's one long continuous session, and you and I know that.

[Poolgod32]

I think PT is great for keeping stats. Using it to track other players seems a bit cumbersome. The gametime plust program seems much more useful to me as I can see stats updated every two minutes with it. It does need PT to work though but it helps to identify the fish snf the really fishy fish in about 10 minutes at the table. This way I can go off of stats that I KNOW not what I THINK I know. It also shows you how much of a winner or lose they have been since you started the program...very important for gauging their play and their possible mindset