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View Full Version : i hate how i played this

bigmac366
12-25-2004, 02:35 PM
Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
UTG folds, Hero calls, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button <font color="#A500AF">(CO)</font> calls, <font color="#CC3333">SB <font color="#A500AF">(SB)</font> raises</font>, BB folds, Hero calls, Button <font color="#A500AF">(CO)</font> calls.

Flop: (7 SB) T/images/graemlins/club.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls, CO folds.

Turn: (4.50 BB) K/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (6.50 BB) 6/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 8.50 BB

should i have raised KQo from ep?
should i have raised the turn or river?

i hate how i played this because i had no idea where i was is the hand. /images/graemlins/confused.gif
SCfuji
12-25-2004, 02:39 PM
i dont usually like to limp unless the table is likely to keep it 1 sb preflop. if i dont limp i raise or fold, definitely raising if its suited. not sure about the flop call but raise the turn and lead the river.
jclin
12-25-2004, 03:05 PM
I don't think it is wrong to call w/KQo. I don't even know if KQs gets a raise from me. On turn, a raise is warranted.
Call down if 3-bet.
Seether
12-25-2004, 03:14 PM
I really think you need to raise or fold this hand from early position.
jclin
12-25-2004, 04:07 PM
This doesn't make any sense. Raise or fold? Why is call not viable? Please explain. Is the correct play always to be aggresive or not be aggresive?
MrSandman
12-25-2004, 04:11 PM
i think KQo is better folding than raising in that position
jclin
12-25-2004, 04:14 PM
[ QUOTE ]
i think KQo is better folding than raising in that position

[/ QUOTE ]

Never a call? From what I've read, it is a raise (at least that's what Hellmuth says). Is it really too weak-tight to make the call?
Entity
12-25-2004, 04:17 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I don't even know if KQs gets a raise from me.

[/ QUOTE ]

It should.

KQo is a raise for me depending on table conditions, but it really doesn't matter a whole ton. Postflop is where the money is at.

It is not a raise/fold situation preflop. Raising is fine, so is limping. You're giving up too much by folding this in EP.

Rob
Entity
12-25-2004, 04:19 PM
[ QUOTE ]
i think KQo is better folding than raising in that position

[/ QUOTE ]

This is horribly weak.

BTW, 1/2 posts go in Micros, not in Small Stakes.

Merry Christmas,
Rob
MrSandman
12-25-2004, 04:19 PM
In my opinion, with the correct conditions you can call (for example, the typical loose game) but generally fold from EP
MrSandman
12-25-2004, 04:22 PM
i didnt understand your post entity....
Entity
12-25-2004, 04:26 PM
[ QUOTE ]
i didnt understand your post entity....

[/ QUOTE ]

My post saying that you're giving up too much by folding KQo in EP? It's just too much of a hand to do so at these limits (even up to 3/6; I don't play 5/10 so I can't comment about there and above). Folding this hand is weak. Calling isn't bad, just depends on table texture.

Rob
Evan
12-25-2004, 04:30 PM
I'm with Entity, KQ is a raise from EP. I'd limp it in 5/10 full, not because of the quality of the players but because they are noticably tighter (which I guess is higher quality of play but they still suck postflop). Folding would really suck.
MrSandman
12-25-2004, 04:34 PM
Giving too much?? Matthew Hilger says folding that hand from EP is better /images/graemlins/wink.gif
Entity
12-25-2004, 04:38 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Giving too much?? Matthew Hilger says folding that hand from EP is better /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I haven't read ITH, so I can't comment. I just know that it's a profitable hand for those who play well postflop (which I am trying to do), and my basis for playing it comes from SSH, which I think is the best small stakes book out there right now.

Rob
Evan
12-25-2004, 04:42 PM
I've never read Hilger's book.

I just looked in PT at KQo and did a filter for 4 of more off the button with a raise preflop and its winning 2.11 bb/hand.
Entity
12-25-2004, 04:47 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I've never read Hilger's book.

I just looked in PT at KQo and did a filter for 4 of more off the button with a raise preflop and its winning 2.11 bb/hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Here's the same discussion at 15/30, a MUCH more aggressive game than 3/6, with generally better players.

Link. (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Number=1429808&amp;page=0&amp;view=colla psed&amp;sb=5&amp;o=14&amp;fpart=1#Post1435505)

KQo has a +EV of .06bb/hand (dunno how Evan got those huge numbers; he must be goot) from UTG according to PokerRoom's EV stats, which are generally pretty solid.

Rob
Entity
12-25-2004, 04:51 PM
If you have any reads, I think raising the river could be a very good play as well.

Rob
MrSandman
12-25-2004, 05:08 PM
Maybe i'm wrong and its better to raise KQo in a loose game /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

If that +EV's stats are correct, folding sucks but in my opinion is too weak for a raise in standard games with 3-5 players/flop.
Entity
12-25-2004, 05:16 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Maybe i'm wrong and its better to raise KQo in a loose game /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

If that +EV's stats are correct, folding sucks but in my opinion is too weak for a raise in standard games with 3-5 players/flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

With 3 players to the flop, I'd limp. With 5, I'd raise. 4 depends on the players behind me and how badly they play postflop. Regardless, it's a fold, like, um, never. Not here. Not at these levels. I'll rethink this when I start playing 30/60. Or maybe 40/80.

Rob