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View Full Version : Weak play on overcards and gutshot?


WSOP Bound
12-24-2004, 11:08 PM
This is a typical problem decision for me. I probably should have played differently preflop, I don't necessarily hate the raise but should have made it more. I am more worried about the flop play. Some quick calculations tell me that I have the odds to call, but I know I am certain I will face another big bet on the turn where I likely will not have the odds. In this situation am I right to just fold here and save my chips for a more profitable fight?


Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t20 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG+1 (t840)
MP1 (t1830)
MP2 (t1165)
CO (t320)
Hero (t1930)
SB (t1875)
BB (t825)
UTG (t1215)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises to t40</font>, UTG+1 calls t40, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, CO folds, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t60</font>, SB calls t50, BB calls t40, UTG calls t20, UTG+1 calls t20.

Flop: (t300) 9/images/graemlins/club.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets t95</font>, BB folds, UTG folds, UTG+1 calls t95, Hero ???

pindawg
12-25-2004, 12:24 AM
You're getting correct odds to call if Ks and Qs are good outs for you.

WSOP Bound
12-25-2004, 12:48 AM
I did post this as gutshot and overcards, but is there anything here that leads you to believe that my overcards are worth much? I'm probably wrong, but it just doesn't feel like TP good kicker ends up being best here. I'm guessing that both opponents have at least a pair with decent kicker, very possibly overlapping either my K or Q.

AA suited
12-25-2004, 02:33 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I did post this as gutshot and overcards, but is there anything here that leads you to believe that my overcards are worth much? I'm probably wrong, but it just doesn't feel like TP good kicker ends up being best here. I'm guessing that both opponents have at least a pair with decent kicker, very possibly overlapping either my K or Q.

[/ QUOTE ]

you have 10 outs. you need 4:1 to call. there's 430 in the pot, and it costs 95 to call. you have your 4:1.

so math wise, calling is fine.

bigredlemon
12-25-2004, 02:47 AM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I did post this as gutshot and overcards, but is there anything here that leads you to believe that my overcards are worth much? I'm probably wrong, but it just doesn't feel like TP good kicker ends up being best here. I'm guessing that both opponents have at least a pair with decent kicker, very possibly overlapping either my K or Q.

[/ QUOTE ]

you have 10 outs. you need 4:1 to call. there's 430 in the pot, and it costs 95 to call. you have your 4:1.

so math wise, calling is fine.

[/ QUOTE ]
Presuming all your outs are live.

Spladle Master
12-25-2004, 07:27 AM
Can you explain the pre-flop min-re-raise? That confused me.

WSOP Bound
12-25-2004, 08:23 AM
Quite simple....It was a bad play. Sitting on a large stack I frequently play mediocre hands like KQo from late position, but wanted to try to get the SB &amp; BB out of the hand. The amount was because I hit the wrong button. My question is more related to the flop play, I know that the preflop was bad.

DougL
12-25-2004, 08:09 PM
I'll take a newbie stab at this one.

It is an easy fold. Not only are your outs not 100% clean, you won't know when you are beat. If you hit a king and face a big bet and/or raise, can you call? This seems like a reverse odds situation as much as it does a pot odds issue. Someone else posted your calling equity. It is close, so I say easy fold.

I'm with you 100% about getting your money in the pot in a better situation. Even with a slightly better overlay, I think I'd fold due to the fact that you have two active players already in the pot.