what to do with pair when rags flop.

[Jordan]

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t600 (5 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

saw flop|<font color="#C00000">saw showdown</font>

<font color="#C00000">Hero (t3663)</font>
<font color="#C00000">UTG (t205)</font>
MP (t3786)
Button (t3254)
<font color="#C00000">SB (t2592)</font>

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
UTG calls t155 (All-In), MP folds, Button folds, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (t1255) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif, 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players, 1 all-in)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t1200</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises to t1942</font>, Hero calls t742.

Final Pot: t5139

$25+2 Turbo
This is perhaps a simple question, but I'd like to know how my flop bet is here. I put the shortstack caller on high cards, maybe a pocket pair, and the SB on high cards, Ax possibly. I bet to protect my vulnerable pair of 4's expecting to take down the side pot right there, when the SB came back over the top of me I figured him for a PP or an 8 possibly, and figured i'd had the odds to call at that point since the pot was giving me nearly 6:1. I guess the question is, do you guys bet this flop?

[nuclear500]

Nah, big blind checking into a pot and scoring 2nd pair, medium kicker? The small blind more then likely has you beat - he did check raise all-in.

If I get to check into a pot as big blind, unless I hit hard (trips, boat, top two, TPBK on a rag board) I don't bother betting it and almost always toss it when its bet. I'd rather check down 2nd pair medium kicker then invest money and then face a raise.

There have been a few times where I was ahead when he bet and I folded or I was raised and he turned over two big cards - it happens. But the cards I hold don't justify trying to play. It cost me nothing (extra) to play the hand, so its not worth playing IMO (there are exceptions of course)

[david050173]

UTG can have anything. SB could also have almost anything but probably at least a somewhat playable hand. After your raise, you have to call so the question is do you want to raise this flop? I think I would want to check it down. Maybe it is weak.

If you raise, you might as well go all in. Take the "bluff" out of his arsenal since you are going to call this bet anyway.

[curtains]

I think it's an automatic bet, and the only question is what is the right amount? I'd bet the minimum here. Partly because its a $25 tournament and partly because someone is allin, so I don't feel like betting 600 or 1200 will have any difference, yet you can fold if the guy wakes up and moves allin.

[ilya]

I think this is a good place to bet, but not as much as you did: there are no draws on this flop, and even a minbet is a substantial part of SB's stack. Betting smaller also allows you to fold if SB comes over the top.
And a minbet looks at least as strong as your larger bet -- if you had hit the flop really hard, would you bet 1200? No, you'd probably make a small bet and try to keep SB around.
So, I'd say bet 600-800 and fold if you get raised. If you get flat-called, check/fold unless you improve.