Stud 8/b hands

[fnord_too]

I am just starting to play stud 8b (played in a little at the beginning of the year). I really don't have a good idea about what I am doing, and am probably folding way too much on third street for the structure. Hand two I thought was a marginal call on third st.

At any rate, coments on all streets greatly appreciated. I am kind of lost in this game.

Hand 1

Player 1 is at seat 1 with $197.
fnord is at seat 2 with $306.
Player 2 is at seat 3 with $104.25.
Player 3 is at seat 4 with $76.50.
Player 4 is at seat 5 with $91.25.
Player 5 is at seat 7 with $98.75 (sitting out).
The button is at seat 1.

Player 3 posts ante ($.50).
Player 2 posts ante ($.50).
fnord posts ante ($.50).
Player 1 posts ante ($.50).
Player 4 posts ante ($.50).

3rd street:

Player 1: -- -- 9s
fnord: 5d 2s 3d
Player 2: -- -- 7h
Player 3: -- -- Kh
Player 4: -- -- Qs

fnord brings in for $1. Player 2 folds. hello
kitty folds. Player 4 raises to $3. Player 1
folds. fnord calls.

4th street:

fnord: 5d 2s 3d 2c
Player 4: -- -- Qs Jh

Player 4 bets $3. fnord calls.

5th street:

fnord: 5d 2s 3d 2c 7d
Player 4: -- -- Qs Jh 3c

Player 4 bets $6. fnord raises to $12. Player 4
calls.

6th street:

fnord: 5d 2s 3d 2c 7d Td
Player 4: -- -- Qs Jh 3c 4s

Player 4 bets $6. fnord calls.

7th street:

fnord: 5d 2s 3d 2c 7d Td Kd
Player 4: -- -- Qs Jh 3c 4s --

Player 4 checks. fnord bets $6.


Hand 2
Player 1 is at seat 1 with $197.
fnord is at seat 2 with $329.
Player 2 is at seat 3 with $114.25.
Player 3 is at seat 4 with $82.
Player 4 is at seat 5 with $56.75.
Player 5 is at seat 7 with $92.25.
The button is at seat 1.

Player 3 posts ante ($.50).
Player 2 posts ante ($.50).
fnord posts ante ($.50).
Player 1 posts ante ($.50).
Player 4 posts ante ($.50).
Player 5 posts ante ($.50).

3rd street:

Player 1: -- -- 2s
fnord: Ac Qc 2c
Player 2: -- -- As
Player 3: -- -- 3c
Player 4: -- -- 3s
Player 5: -- -- 4c

fnord brings in for $1. Player 2 raises to $3.
Player 3 folds. Player 4 folds. Player 5
folds. Player 1 folds. fnord calls.

4th street:

fnord: Ac Qc 2c Qd
Player 2: -- -- As 2d

Player 2 bets $3. fnord calls.

5th street:

fnord: Ac Qc 2c Qd 4h
Player 2: -- -- As 2d Jc

Player 2 bets $6. fnord raises to $12. Player 2
calls.

6th street:

fnord: Ac Qc 2c Qd 4h Js
Player 2: -- -- As 2d Jc 9s

Player 2 checks. fnord bets $6. Player 2 calls.


7th street:

fnord: Ac Qc 2c Qd 4h Js 9c
Player 2: -- -- As 2d Jc 9s --

Player 2 checks. fnord checks.

[jon_1van]

I like hand 1.

Hand 2 is another story.

You decide to play a flush draw heads up versus ?? what ?
I don't know what "what" is but it isn't a hand you have an edge against. I say pick a better spot unless the opponent is a complete goober.

-Your flush draw is wounded because of your 2 dead clubs
-If he has a pair...any pair...you are significant dog.
-You are a huge dog if he does have AA.
-If he has 3 to a low you are a tiny dog.

If I do play...I don't know what to think. It seems that you don't think he has AA otherwise why play. So when you get your Q shouldn't you raise? But then again..by calling 4th you might have induced a bet where one wasn't warranted.

So I think you shouldn't play this because the hand gets soo damn confusing.

I would compare this to calling a preflop all-in with 66 in NLHE. Yeah, you might be ahead by a wee margin...but being wrong is gonna be expensive.

[Andy B]

Hand 1:

I would probably bring it in for a full bet. The call on fourth street was OK, in my estimation. The raise on fifth was extremely dubious. I don't think you're folding him, and you need to catch. You won't really be able to represent a straight on sixth no matter what you catch. Call on sixth was good. I'm a little surprised he bet it. Nice river.

Hand 2:

I don't like how you played this one. I'm not too excited about the Queen on fourth, but I probably call. The raise on fifth was hopeless. Do you think you have the best hand? Do you think the other guy is going to fold? At least you checked the river.

If you're lost, buy Ray Zee's book and read it a few times.

[fnord_too]

Thanks for the replies. I definitely need to pick up Ray Zee's book.

In the second hand, I thought the player was on a steal and would lay down to the raise. (I am probably folding 80+% of my hands on third street).

One thing I have been doing, and I do not know the merit of it, is bringing in for the minimum regardless of my hand. I will limp/reraise some with a big hand, but since I usually bring-in/fold, I have been experimenting with always bringing it in for the minimum.

I am strugling with what marginal hands are playable, when should I try to limp in, and when I should keep playing. I fold a lot on fourth and fifth street. (I usually drop the hammer on fifth street when I have the goods, so I did think that there was a good chance of getting a fold in the first hand.)

So far I have been getting by ok at this level by playing very tight pre flop (probably too tight for the ante's) and (usually) playing pretty well on later streets. I am hyper aware of the big pitfalls, like chasing half the pot and playing hands that are marginal in both directions.

I think I may be putting too much emphasis on deception (well, unreadability more than active deception). Of course the opposition is pretty weak. There are a few players who seem to play well, but usually also a few who play just awful.

I really like the game. Unfortunately, I cannot easily multi-table stud games (since I have to keep track of dead cards).