ATo UTG, difficult flop situation

[JrJordan]

Button in this hand is loose and relatively aggressive (45/17), MP is a little less loose, but has been pretty darn passive in the little time I've seen him (33/5). I think I made this hand a lot harder on myself than it needed to be.


Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, MP calls, <font color="#CC3333">CO 3-bets $2.75 (All-In)</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button caps</font>, SB folds, BB folds, Hero calls, MP calls.

Flop: (15.50 SB) T/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players, 1 all-in)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP bets</font>, Button calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, MP calls, Button calls.

<font color="blue"> I don't like my line here at all. At the time I believe I was trying to checkraise the button when he bets out, but that makes little sense because all I have is friggen 2nd pair, top kicker. Should I just check/call instead of trying to take control of the hand? </font>

Turn: (10.75 BB) 7/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players, 1 all-in)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, MP calls, Button calls.

River: (13.75 BB) K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players, 1 all-in)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, MP folds, Button calls.

Final Pot: 15.75 BB

I feel obligated to bet the turn when I don't face any aggression after the c/r, and then again on the river when another K hits the board that I felt like no one had because of their passiveness earlier.

[naphand]

I like this line. You have 2nd-pair top kicker, backdoor flush and a scratchy straight draw (QJ). You have dead money in the pot, so you want a side pot of some kind.

I would prefer the flop raise if it was knocking players out, but against an aggressive player certainly capable of betting a worse hand than yours, and the drawy board when MP will call with any Q or J. Of course, it is not button (LAG) doing the betting here and you are out of position. Even so, it is fairly certain you are against at least one player drawing. I'm not sure our hand is strong enough to raise the Turn when a blank falls, taking the initiative is good.

You are not raised and your Turn bet is not punished, you must be feeling quite good about your hand here, you are probably winning more than your fair share. Do you fold to a Turn raise? (call and check/fold depending on River, would be my line). What about a River raise?

I do not think you made life difficult for yourself here, check/calling down 2nd-pair on this kind of board is wrong, IMO. You made life easier for yourself as folding on the expensive streets would have been easier, saving you at least half a bet when behind or costing you the same as check-calling. You actually made life a lot harder for your opponents by doing this. You will get more action later when you CR TP or better, they wont automatically put you on the nuts.

[Apocalypse]

well maybe its just me, but i check-call all the way here, although i doubt it my rivercall would be profitable, if mp would lead the river and gets called by the button.

Then again, im still working on a better understanding in shifts in strategy when it comes to mainpots and sidepots. So perhaps im off, but i don't think a line of checkcalling could be really considered wrong here as naphand suggested

[Jdanz]

i don't really think this is a bad line, you basically force your opponents to shut down unless they have you nice and solidly beat, in which case it's an easy fold to any further aggression (though it's only in hindsight we know he's not getting three bet on the flop).

However..... I'm not sure what i do but calling another two cold with Ato is not a situation i like being in. Out of position even with great odds i might fold it, as i'm drawing to at most three outs here i think.

[Jeff W]

I'd fold pre flop even against aggressive players. Your hand is often dominated and you're out of position.

On the flop, I would be miffed that MP prevented me from check/raising the Button. This is a tough spot. If you call, there is no gaurantee that you can protect your hand on the turn. Naked gutshots won't have odds if you wait till the turn to come alive, but pair+gutshot hands will have odds no matter what. Both check-raising and waiting for a safe turn card to raise or fold are viable lines. Given the action, you're probably not ahead if a J or Q hits. Playing strong pairs on coordinated high card boards in big multiway pots is extremely difficult.

Turn and river are standard value bets after you check-raise the flop.

[hypermegachi]

do you normally call cold with ATo? i don't, so i woulda folded this preflop. being out of position is more than enough reason to fold for me. the decision with ATs is close however.

everything else looks standard.

[Alobar]

Everything looks fine to me. Normally I wouldnt call 2 more to see this flop, but with an aggro button raising an all in, I think its more likely he has a weaker hand than normal, so I call as well.

Going for the flop c/r is good, but MP screws that up, after button doesnt raise it, I go ahead and c/r anyway.

being out of posistion the turn bet is pretty much standard, the pot is very large and you cant really check. Once you dont get raised and the K falls on the river, I bet out again.

I think this hand was nicely played

[vulture]

Hi,

I would have folded preflop.

Vulture

[helpmeout]

I dont like your flop play here, you have middle pair TK against someone who capped preflop and a passive player who bets out.

I'd probably call down unless you improve or there is a raise. (I'm folding if button raises).

45/17 isnt crazy aggression preflop I would think he will show you JJ QQ a lot of the time here.