Another Pocket Pair w/overpair on board hand.

[Fat Nicky]

Hate these hands, expecially with no reads on my opponents.

UB 3/6 (9 handed)

Pre-flop: Hero raises UTG w/J/images/graemlins/spade.gif J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, MP1 calls, CO calls.

3 to the flop for 7.3 SB.

Flop: 2/images/graemlins/club.gif Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif
Hero bets, MP1 calls, CO folds.

2 to the turn for ~4.5 BB

Turn: 8/images/graemlins/club.gif
Hero bets, MP1 raises, Hero ????

What the standard play against an unknown, call down or fold??

[Alexthegreat]

I think in this situation, I check-call down after the flop...Some people may see that as being weak, but letting him bet for you is fine, and saves you one bet when he actually has the goods....

Most players will bet here when checked to, no matter what they hold, so I wouldn't be too concerned about missing a bet....

[Fat Nicky]

[ QUOTE ]
I think in this situation, I check-call down after the flop...Some people may see that as being weak, but letting him bet for you is fine, and saves you one bet when he actually has the goods....

Most players will bet here when checked to, no matter what they hold, so I wouldn't be too concerned about missing a bet....

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With my aggressive nature, I didn't think to play the hand this way.

Does anyone agree with this line.

[chief444]

[ QUOTE ]
Does anyone agree with this line.

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No. I think you absolutely need to keep betting until raised here.

As for whether to call down or not I would say it's close. I would probably call down. I may even call the turn and bet the river but fold to a raise. That would probably be my most often used line here. Something else I may consider is calling the turn and check/folding the river since a lot of opponents will check a worse hand through on the river after you already called the turn. But I really don't like that here or out of position.

[lil']

I bet the flop here. Most of the time you are way ahead, and people love to call with their crap on boards like this all the time, which is a huge mistake for them and a great thing for you. If you know your opponent loves to bluff at boards like this or always bets when checked to, then the check call approach may work. However, I can't pass up the opportunity to let my opponent make the terrible mistake of calling with three outs or less, and they do it ALL the time.

I call down here a fair bit of the time. You see a lot of wacky raises. Some players you know you can't do it against, but against an unkown I would do it more often.

[Alexthegreat]

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I may even call the turn and bet the river but fold to a raise. That would probably be my most often used line here

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This would cost the same as calling down, without getting to see his cards....why on earth would you bet the river?? I would assume that anything he's raised the turn with he's going to bet come the river, and if he checks behind with a worse hand, so be it...

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Something else I may consider is calling the turn and check/folding the river since a lot of opponents will check a worse hand through on the river after you already called the turn

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once again, a reason for you to check-call the turn....I should have pointed out that after the flop, with no reads, I really want a showdown....if you check the turn, only the weakest players are not going to bet....You get a bet in on the turn and then you can decide what to do on the river, with check-calling still a very real option....

I guess that I disagree with the estimation that most players will call the flop with junk and check behind on the turn....I mean, say your villian has something like, A6o....he calls your flop bet and you check the turn...he's going to bet...why wouldn't he?? If he DOES check behind, he probably calls you down on a blank river, which makes you one more bet than you otherwise would have made with someone holding such junk...

[chief444]

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I would assume that anything he's raised the turn with he's going to bet come the river

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I will often raise the turn with the intention of checking the river unimproved, especially against a passive opponent. If you think you are behind but have a hand worth showing down you lose the same but win more when you are ahead.

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a reason for you to check-call the turn....I should have pointed out that after the flop, with no reads, I really want a showdown

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Of course you want a showdown. You will normally have the best hand given the action to that point. That's why you bet.

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I guess that I disagree with the estimation that most players will call the flop with junk and check behind on the turn....I mean, say your villian has something like, A6o....he calls your flop bet and you check the turn...he's going to bet...why wouldn't he?? If he DOES check behind, he probably calls you down on a blank river, which makes you one more bet than you otherwise would have made with someone holding such junk...

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If you knew your opponent held A6, would you check the turn? I wouldn't.