Bubble hand hell

[rci97]

Blinds 150 - 300

UTG (t4000)
Button (t250)
SB (t1950)
Hero (t1350), dealt Kh Qh

UTG calls t300, Button folds, SB completes, Hero checks

flop Ks,Kd,3c
SB checks, hero checks, UTG checks

turn 7h
SB bets 300, hero calls, UTG folds

river 2d
SB all-in, Hero ???

Okay, I'm probably going to get flamed on this one. I wasn't slow playing when I checked the flop. I actually just wanted to show down the hand cheaply (weak???) given the fact that the SS was so low and both these guys had me covered. Should I have just gone all-in on the flop? I realize that by checking and calling, I am allowing my opponent to fill up if he has a weaker king. But I was also thinking that if the other K is out there I'm going all in and going to get called (usually great) taking the chance that I bust and let the SS slide ITM. Obviously, normally I'm loving this flop, but how should I play this on the bubble with the other guy so shortstacked? Is all in on the flop the best play to protect what is almost undoubtedly the best hand? Would you call or fold on the river?

[spentrent]

Bet something on the flop! A lot of times I might bet half that stack (yours, which is about half the pot) to give a lesser opponent the illusion of fold equity. Won't work against tight players or better players who know what you're up to, but at the same time, that pot is big enough for you to take down right now.

[eastbay]

We may have to start a "Weakie Of The Week" award. You my friend are a shoe-in for this week.

You want to be thinking max payoff here. Any other thought is psychotic.

eastbay

[(my name it is) Sam Hall]

These are the hands that turn "get ITM" tournaments into wins. I think SB goes all-in BECAUSE he has you covered. Even if he loses, he's still 2.5x the smallest stack and probably finishes third. If he wins the hand, he's back in it with UTG for the tournament win. My answer to the given ??? is call 100% of the time, and my guess is he's playing two pair, kings and something.

[texasrattlers]

[ QUOTE ]
SB all-in, Hero ???

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you serious? If so, then you should call. Whether you intended to or not, I think your play on the flop and turn has convinced the SB that you do not have a K.

[rci97]

Like I said, I knew I'd get flamed on... It's just that the last two times faced with almost this exact situation, I went for "max payoff" only to lose to a full house while letting a ridiculously shortstacked opponent (less than 1 BB in one of the cases) slip ITM. This time, I decided to play it "safe" (I know, more like "stupid") only to allow SB to hit the boat on the river (I called). You ever go through a streak where such bad luck starts to affect your thinking? Where you almost expect to get drawn out on? Next time, I'll bet the flop to extract the most chips I can. Thanks for the a$$ chewing. I deserved it! I don't mean this as some kind of bad beat post, more like a theoretical question I guess as to if there is someone really SS (like 1BB), should you ever play a big hand slower rather than take the small chance of busting. I guess the answer is that if he gets lucky and hits a 3 outer, oh well...

[eastbay]

[ QUOTE ]
Like I said, I knew I'd get flamed on... It's just that the last two times faced with almost this exact situation, I went for "max payoff" only to lose to a full house while letting a ridiculously shortstacked opponent (less than 1 BB in one of the cases) slip ITM.

[/ QUOTE ]

Correct play (probably). Good for you.

[ QUOTE ]

This time, I decided to play it "safe" (I know, more like "stupid") only to allow SB to hit the boat on the river (I called). You ever go through a streak where such bad luck starts to affect your thinking?


[/ QUOTE ]

Subtley, maybe. It does not turn my brain to jello, however.

[ QUOTE ]

Where you almost expect to get drawn out on? Next time, I'll bet the flop to extract the most chips I can. Thanks for the a$$ chewing. I deserved it! I don't mean this as some kind of bad beat post, more like a theoretical question I guess as to if there is someone really SS (like 1BB), should you ever play a big hand slower rather than take the small chance of busting. I guess the answer is that if he gets lucky and hits a 3 outer, oh well...

[/ QUOTE ]

A "safer" but slightly less stupid play than trying to get through "cheaply" is to move in on the flop.

eastbay

[rci97]

Thanks for your replies... The question ONLY came up because the 4th guy was so shortstacked. I too figured the SB would see my checking as weakness and might push because he had me covered. After busting and giving the SS an early Christmas present, I figured I'd check with you guys to see if the bubble situation would affect the play of the hand. No way to avoid going broke here without being a complete wuss. I have to tend to my mushy brain and damaged ego now. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[rachelwxm]

[ QUOTE ]
I wasn't slow playing when I checked the flop. I actually just wanted to show down the hand cheaply (weak???)

[/ QUOTE ]
I actually think you play it fine as a slow play although your thinking is what got you all the flames. If you move in on flop and take it down, your EV=30.8. If you double up through sb your EV=35.8. So I am OK to slow play at this point considering he is likely having 2 outs at most.

I guess you called the river as I would 100% here. So from result perspective I would do the same.

If I feel I am much better player than the field, I would probably not slow play at this point. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Cornell Fiji]

obviously bet the flop and call an all in... this has already been pointed out.

Another thing to consider here is that folding to the all in (a pretty rediculous play) would leave you with 1050 chips. Now if the short stack were to go all in on the next hand (as he would do in an attempt to win two blinds) and win with you folding your small blind he would have T700, if he were to go all in and get the SB to push over the top and fold he would have T1,000, meanwhile you would lose your small blind and be down to 900. Now the blinds are going to hit him next but your terrible fold might actually take you out of the money where a call would bring you to T3,000 where you can play for the real money.

-Steve

[ QUOTE ]
Blinds 150 - 300

UTG (t4000)
Button (t250)
SB (t1950)
Hero (t1350), dealt Kh Qh

UTG calls t300, Button folds, SB completes, Hero checks

flop Ks,Kd,3c
SB checks, hero checks, UTG checks

turn 7h
SB bets 300, hero calls, UTG folds

river 2d
SB all-in, Hero ???

Okay, I'm probably going to get flamed on this one. I wasn't slow playing when I checked the flop. I actually just wanted to show down the hand cheaply (weak???) given the fact that the SS was so low and both these guys had me covered. Should I have just gone all-in on the flop? I realize that by checking and calling, I am allowing my opponent to fill up if he has a weaker king. But I was also thinking that if the other K is out there I'm going all in and going to get called (usually great) taking the chance that I bust and let the SS slide ITM. Obviously, normally I'm loving this flop, but how should I play this on the bubble with the other guy so shortstacked? Is all in on the flop the best play to protect what is almost undoubtedly the best hand? Would you call or fold on the river?

[/ QUOTE ]

[Unarmed]

Funny post, I check flop, push turn but I don't even have to make this decision because I push PF 100% of the time at this buy-in.

[EnderW27]

I agree with pushing preflop. Look what would have happened:

If UTG folds, SB with a King and weak kicker probably would not have called you when he's committing 2/3 of his stack and didn't even want to raise PF. In this case you win 600 more chips and are now in second in chip position.

If UTG calls, SB absolutely will not call you because he's not about to risk busting out on this mediocre hand when there's the potential of two other people ready to bust out.
If this happens you double up because you'd have beat UTG at the river.