Ok -- and a hand that I hate how I played (KTs)

[Entity]

I'm not sure what my motivation was for playing this hand this way. I think I wanted to get away from my hand cheaply.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, Hero calls, <font color="CC3333">MP1 <font color="purple">(Gravy)</font> raises</font>, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds, Hero calls.

Flop: (5.50 SB) 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="CC3333">Gravy bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, Gravy calls.

Turn: (4.75 BB) J/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">Hero bets</font>, Gravy calls.

River: (6.75 BB) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">Hero bets</font>, Gravy calls.

Final Pot: 8.75 BB

[Gravy (Gravy Smoothie)]

I liked the way you played it, Entity. Villian had 99.
I called down because I couldn't think of a hand with a K that Entity would limp here preflop...turns out he had the only one that makes much sense.

[Shillx]

Yikes. This is a Check-call/check-call/check-fold IMO, unless Gravy will bluff again on the river (which he shouldn't /images/graemlins/cool.gif).

Brad

[btspider]

what about check-call, check-call, bet?

[Entity]

[ QUOTE ]
Yikes. This is a Check-call/check-call/check-fold IMO, unless Gravy will bluff again on the river (which he shouldn't /images/graemlins/cool.gif).

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]
I was all ready for check-call, check-call, bet, but then I figured hmm...I can save a few bets here if I checkraise and he 3-bets, because I can fold right here. Obviously it sucks if he 3-bets QQ but I don't think he does that against me.

Then I'm sitting there, after he calls, thinking -- ok -- bet and he'll fold the turn, sine he's got to have an underpair.

Damnit, he didn't fold. Wouldn't he raise KJ here? Would he just calldown with KQ? No way.

Damnit, what does he have???

Kids, this is why we stick to nice lines like check/call, check/call, bet.

Rob

[Shillx]

Yeah checkcall/checkcall/bet is always the best line heads up ouf of position when you flop top pair Aces (and Kings to a lesser extent). When you flop something like top pair Jacks or Tens, this line isn't so attractive unless hands like AK or AQ will call you on the river (why you should usually check/fold the river against a TAG).

Shill

[kenberman]

Maybe I'm missing something, but nothing jumps out at me as poor Entity play here.

My default line here - which is the same mindless line as too many others - is to check/call the flop, and check/raise the turn.

but this works.

[Shillx]

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe I'm missing something, but nothing jumps out at me as poor Entity play here.

My default line here - which is the same mindless line as too many others - is to check/call the flop, and check/raise the turn.

but this works.

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh??? /images/graemlins/shocked.gif /images/graemlins/shocked.gif /images/graemlins/shocked.gif /images/graemlins/confused.gif /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Entity]

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe I'm missing something, but nothing jumps out at me as poor Entity play here.

My default line here - which is the same mindless line as too many others - is to check/call the flop, and check/raise the turn.

but this works.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is a really bad line in situations like this, because you'll lose the most to a hand like AK, and win the least from a hand like QQ.

Rob

[DeathDonkey]

Totally agree on the C/C, C/C, bet line. But, when he calls your flop C/R and then just calls your turn bet, there is like no way you don't have the best hand. The river is an easy value bet and you have nothing to fear. He's calling down with a PP here because he thinks your making a move. I've tried to bluff my TAG roommate so many times and always get called down, I recognize these value bet situations now. Heck I can value bet him with 22 and get called by Ace high, and you can do the same to Gravy apparently. Then when he starts respecting your raises and folding, that's the time to start C/R semibluffing and crap...fun game huh?

-DeathDonkey

[kenberman]

I agree with this:
[ QUOTE ]
because you'll lose the most to a hand like AK

[/ QUOTE ]

but not nec. with this:
[ QUOTE ]
win the least from a hand like QQ

[/ QUOTE ]

I think most players at this level aren't capable of folding QQ to a turn c/r, river bet here. Sure I'll get 3 bet sometimes, but if my read is that I'm ahead, I'm gonna go ahead and try to win the most.

but I can see the danger in it.

[Shillx]

A TAG will often just call the flop check/raise, call the turn and then raise the river with something like AK or AA. This is exactly how I would play AK/AA if I were the villian here.

Shill

[srt19170]

[ QUOTE ]

I was all ready for check-call, check-call, bet, but then I figured hmm...I can save a few bets here if I checkraise and he 3-bets, because I can fold right here.


[/ QUOTE ]

I think you're generally ahead after the flop, so I like your line. As long as you're willing to switch to check/call (or fold) if he 3 bets to the flop or raises the turn, this line only costs you 1 bet when you're losing and gains you at least a bet when you're winning. Since I think you're winning more than 50% of the time, it seems like the right line to me.

Do you think you're ahead after the flop?

-- Scott

[btspider]

[ QUOTE ]
Totally agree on the C/C, C/C, bet line. But, when he calls your flop C/R and then just calls your turn bet, there is like no way you don't have the best hand. The river is an easy value bet and you have nothing to fear. He's calling down with a PP here because he thinks your making a move.

[/ QUOTE ]

he'll often be calling down with KQ, or smooth-calls the turn intending to bet/raise a big hand on the river since a PP could fold to a turn raise fairly easily.