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View Full Version : terrible KK fold?


topspin
12-07-2004, 04:24 PM
Villain is LP-P with 55/0/0.38 over 30 hands or so. Easy fold given read and board?

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif. MP3 posts a blind of $0.5.
UTG calls, <font color="666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="666666">5 folds</font>, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (7.50 SB) 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif, A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB folds, UTG calls.

Turn: (4.75 BB) 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">UTG bets</font>, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 5.75 BB

VBM
12-07-2004, 04:32 PM
The relatively small pot makes me lean towards "no"

if he's truly a passive player, calling your flop bet then leading the turn screams of strength. however, i question whether 30 hands is enough to truly gauge this. did you actively watch any of the hands he played?

Megenoita
12-07-2004, 04:36 PM
I would at least call it down! I've found (Party 1/2) that often people are bluffing when they bet into you, and this is true with loose-passives, too. Plus, you don't really know this guy-it's only been 30 hands. You have no specific reads on him, right? You have to call it down; I would probably raise, but then, I'm no proven poker stud.

Stork
12-07-2004, 04:38 PM
At the micro limits I'd venture to say that you should be calling this down.

zram21
12-07-2004, 04:40 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I've found (Party 1/2) that often people are bluffing when they bet into you, and this is true with loose-passives, too.

[/ QUOTE ]

If a player is regularly betting into you on the turn as a bluff he is not a passive player.

topspin
12-07-2004, 04:45 PM
[ QUOTE ]
if he's truly a passive player, calling your flop bet then leading the turn screams of strength. however, i question whether 30 hands is enough to truly gauge this. did you actively watch any of the hands he played?

[/ QUOTE ]

30 hands is definitely a weak read. UTG has been an unremarkable player over the hands I saw him in; no raises or 3-bets from him.

The main considerations for me to make this fold were:

1) small pot size
2) overcard on the flop
3) board makes straights and two pairs likely

Either he's a straightforward player who just turned 2-pair and was too simple to check-raise, or the turn bet is a bluff. I could have called it down for 2BB more, but I've been trying to cut down on my auto-calldowns. Note I have to be good here more than 2 in 7 (~30%) for a calldown to pay off.

Megenoita
12-07-2004, 07:22 PM
I understand that if someone is "regularly" betting into you, they are not a passive player. What I am saying is this...you have 30 hands seen of this guy, no specific reads, it's HU and you have KK on a board that only really threatens you w/ an Ace...the guy bets into you on the turn. My point is that he may not be passive at all, and even passive players do strange things HU at these levels. I think it's clear to call it down, no?