Best Martial Art Movie

[ToneLoc]

Looking to expand my martial art DVD section...

My try is Ong-Bak, seriously violent muay-thai movie...

[Reef]

Hero with Jet Li

I also thought Chinese Connection was one of Bruce Lee's greatest

[Jnana]

The Last Dragon

[Paluka]

Iron Monkey
Dragon Inn

Both are cool movies.

[nicky g]

Drunken Master is probably the best I've seen. I've not seen that many though. Blade is quite a cool MA film IMO. Kickboxing vampires are all right by me.

[jakethebake]

What are we judging this based on? The movie quality? Martial arts realism? Choreography? Cool acrobatic stuff?

Stupidest movie ever was Angel Town with Olivier Gruner, but I liked some of the martial arts aspects of it, and I learned a good sweep from watching it over and over.

I liked The Perfect Weapon with Jeff Speakman. Although I don't like him and think he's a total ass, I liked Seagal's early movies (let the flames begin). I preferred Brandon Lee's movies to Bruce's. Although, I liked any of Bruce Lee's movies o.k. too.

I haven't seen many Asian films I really like except for their brainless goofiness to watch on a Saturday morning. They mostly tend to have flying ninjas and half-hour sequences of people doing Wing Chun poorly.

[ToneLoc]

I was thinking more about the quality of the martial art... as such EVERY Seagal movie is disqualified...

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
I was thinking more about the quality of the martial art... as such EVERY Seagal movie is disqualified...

[/ QUOTE ]I disagree on that point. I think his are actually better on that front than most. Not that he doesn't do some really silly stuff. But they all seem to.

[ToneLoc]

I just think he is rather unimpressive compared to the masters of the genre... both on technical an aesthetic point of view.

[nicky g]

Yeah, isn't Seagal a genuine Aikido umpteenth Dan or something?

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, isn't Seagal a genuine Aikido umpteenth Dan or something?

[/ QUOTE ]True. But isn't everybody these days? Does anyone else remember back in the late 80s when he was going around claiming to be the baddest guy on Earth? He like issued an open invitation to take on all comers or something silly. He specifically called out some of the old Karate guys by name, and had a few of them pretty worked up about it. It was all pretty funny.

[whiskeytown]

Jet Li in the Once Upon a Time in China series (1-3) were pretty good -

the dragon mask scene at the end of number 3 is just wild.

RB

[ThaSaltCracka]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, isn't Seagal a genuine Aikido umpteenth Dan or something?

[/ QUOTE ]True. But isn't everybody these days?

[/ QUOTE ]LMAO

I think Blade deserves some mentions, [censored] even almost anything JC is in has some cray stuff man. My personal fav though, Bruce Lee in Big Boss, that ice plant stuff is killah!

[nicky g]

Who's JC?

Yeah Big Boss was good.

[oddjob]

[ QUOTE ]
Jet Li in the Once Upon a Time in China series (1-3) were pretty good -

the dragon mask scene at the end of number 3 is just wild.

RB

[/ QUOTE ]

yes these are good. they follow the same character as jackie chan's drunken master, but when he is more mature. also the same character the kid plays in iron monkey (i believe played by a girl).

another good jet li movie is twin warriors. funny with some good fight scenes, if you can get over the whole superhuman abilities thing.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
I think Blade deserves some mentions, [censored] even almost anything JC is in has some cray stuff man.

[/ QUOTE ] JC?

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
yes these are good. they follow the same character as jackie chan's drunken master, but when he is more mature.

[/ QUOTE ]And sober. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[nicky g]

"if you can get over the whole superhuman abilities thing. "

I liekd Twin Warriors (also known as Tai Chi Master) but in general I hate this. Not being able fight a billion people at once or whatever - that's what MA movies are about; just when they can fly or jump enormous distances etc. That's magic, not martial arts.

[ThaSaltCracka]

Jesus Christ, man that guy can fight. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

No, JC= Jackie Chan. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
Jesus Christ, man that guy can fight. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

No, JC= Jackie Chan. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]He was in Blade?

[Bubbagump]

I hightly recommend you get your hands on anything Jett Li did prior to 'Romeo Must Die'. I'm not saying this movie and his other recent movies are bad, I just think the imported stuff he did is so much better.

My personal Favorites are:

Fist of Legend - It's an homage to Bruce Lee's The Chinese Connection. And I prefer the Jett Li version over Bruce's. It's my all time favority MA movie.

The Tai Chi Master and New Legends of Shaolin are also really good. There is a little kid in New Legends that is just amazing!

Bubbagump

[nicky g]

"Fist of Legend - It's an homage to Bruce Lee's The Chinese Connection. And I prefer the Jett Li version over Bruce's. It's my all time favority MA movie."

Yeah excellent film. The Bruce Lee film it remakes is called Fist of Fury over here.

[ThaSaltCracka]

no, I was merely stating after I said Blade, that nearly any movie JC has been in there have been some crazy martial arts.

[elwoodblues]

I have heard that an old martial arts movie called Budo (maybe Budho or Buddho?) was good. Anyone seen it?

[oddjob]

[ QUOTE ]
"if you can get over the whole superhuman abilities thing. "

I liekd Twin Warriors (also known as Tai Chi Master) but in general I hate this. Not being able fight a billion people at once or whatever - that's what MA movies are about; just when they can fly or jump enormous distances etc. That's magic, not martial arts.

[/ QUOTE ]

to me this is no different from american movies that feature magical guns that can shoot 40 rounds without reloading. i just ignore these details, and try to enjoy the movie.

[jakethebake]

...was a great one. The Magnificant Seven was a remake of this movie.

[nicky g]

I think the fighting a billion opponents thing is similar to the unrealistic gun stuff. The flying is more comparable to, well, flying. Like if Mel Gibson started floating above Danny Glover's head in Lethal Weapon. More than a detail to me.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
to me this is no different from american movies that feature magical guns that can shoot 40 rounds without reloading. i just ignore these details, and try to enjoy the movie.

[/ QUOTE ] 1) There ARE guns that can fire 40 rounds. 2) It's easier to just think we don't see them reload, than it is to ignore the guy flying through the air.

[Paluka]

[ QUOTE ]
...was a great one. The Magnificant Seven was a remake of this movie.

[/ QUOTE ]

Seven Samurai is completely devoid of martial arts...

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
...was a great one. The Magnificant Seven was a remake of this movie.

[/ QUOTE ]

Seven Samurai is completely devoid of martial arts...

[/ QUOTE ]
I qualify Iaido or Kendo as martial arts. Not to mention aside from technique, much of the underlying stratrgy and mental aspects are the same. Every martial artist should read "The Unfettered Mind" by Takuan Soho, not to mention the "Book of Five Rings".

[Paluka]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
...was a great one. The Magnificant Seven was a remake of this movie.

[/ QUOTE ]

Seven Samurai is completely devoid of martial arts...

[/ QUOTE ]
I qualify Iaido or Kendo as martial arts. Not to mention aside from technique, much of the underlying stratrgy and mental aspects are the same. Every martial artist should read "The Unfettered Mind" by Takuan Soho, not to mention the "Book of Five Rings".

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay maybe all this is true, i'm not even sure what some of these words mean. But I do know that when someone says "hey, I'm looking to expand my dvd collection to include some good martial arts films" they aren't asking for 3 hour long samurai epics.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
But I do know that when someone says "hey, I'm looking to expand my dvd collection to include some good martial arts films" they aren't asking for 3 hour long samurai epics.

[/ QUOTE ]I don't know that at all. If it was me, it would. I can't speak for TL. I just made a suggestion that he can take or leave.

[deacsoft]

I will not go as far as to say that it's the best, but I purchased and watched HERO last night. A film presented by Quentin Tarantino, staring Jet Li, Donnie Yen, Tony Leung, Maggie Cheung, Zhang Ziyi, and Chen Dao Ming, and directed by Zhang Yimou (who also contributed to the story and screenplay). I loved the film and will not even go in to writing a review. I will just say this: Take $20.00 and go to Best Buy, Wal-Mart, or where ever and buy it. You will not be disappointed.

[oddjob]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
to me this is no different from american movies that feature magical guns that can shoot 40 rounds without reloading. i just ignore these details, and try to enjoy the movie.

[/ QUOTE ] 1) There ARE guns that can fire 40 rounds. 2) It's easier to just think we don't see them reload, than it is to ignore the guy flying through the air.

[/ QUOTE ]

true but these movies are mythology to the chinese. i guess it's more like watching a king arthur movie and accepting that merlin does magic, or that a sword can only be pulled out of a stone by arthur.

i just accept taht they may consider the highest levels of kung fu to be at a point where you can run on walls, jump 40 ft. and hopefully pull out a guy's heart and show it to them before they die, a part of the ultimate skills obtained in kung fu training. something that may be lost in the present day.

people believe the bible, and that dude could walk on water and come back to life. btw, i think jesus would have kicked ass if he grew up with a martial arts background.

[M2d]

http://www.operagloves.com/Modernstars/PrincesBeauties/vanity-oneglove.jpg
Yeah, that works

[Blarg]

Iron Monkey is really a lot of fun. Many of the martial arts scenes in it are excellent -- disregard the flying around stuff, although it seems to not annoy me in this movie for maybe the first time ever, since it's often so beautifully imaginative. It doesn't seem to just serve the technique and therefore look ridiculous, I mean -- it's more an expressive thing. But forget the flying -- it's got great fight scenes.

I really liked Donnie Yen in that one, and he's also great in the Once Upon A Time in China II. He also did some of the martial arts in Blade II, I think.

I think my favorite fight scene, and one that will probably last for all time because it attempted what fight scenes never really do, is the Bruce Lee fight scene in Return of the Dragon with Chuck Norris. The whole fight is psychological, and hinges on one person's psychological flexibility saving him and another's psychological limitations making him first not adapt, and then adapt too little, too late. It puts me in mind that way of why Sam Jackson lived in Pulp Fiction and John Travolta died. I've never seen another fight scene constructed so clearly on a psychological level. Most are just about fighting. Not a great movie overall, but it's amazing that to this day, nobody has really imitated Bruce's breakthrough fight choreography and designed a fight scene that concentrates on what's going on in a fighter's head, rather than merely records his arms and legs flying around.

Of the Bruce Lee movies, I think Chinese Connection is the most watchable and satisfying. It has themes that are extremely dear to the Chinese, and had terrific resonance with them. That whole "Sick Men of Asia" sign, the "No Dogs and Chinese Allowed" sign on the park carved out of their territory, the abuse and humiliation by both the Japanese and Westerners, really ate at the Chinese. They went out of their minds having a hero and world class macho male role model at last in Lee. Lots of resonance in this movie, and more sustained and interesting action than any of his others.

I've seen a bunch of Jackie Chan movies, but unfortunately many of them were the super horrible ones, like Spiritual Kung Fu, where he seems to be getting involved with gay ghosts or something. The one with Maggie Cheung was a lot of fun, Super Cop or Project A or something, I don't know. But the one I really like the best of the smallish selection of what I've seen is the original Drunken Master. There are sustained fight scenes here shot the right way, without a ton of cutting messing things up and making people look better than they are. And the drunken style is just very interesting. The villain Jackie goes up against is also very fun to watch -- a great kicker. And it has one of the things that I love best in kung fu movies -- training sequences and a hero who gets better because of his training and shows it. More drama that way. Plus the Columbia version suprised me with truly excellent commentary that gives a lot of color about Jackie and his pals at the Chinese opera school he trained at, and other people in the film.

A comment about Blade -- the beginning of the first one was fantastic. But none of the martial arts moves or scenes Blade was personally involved with in the that movie or the next came close to matching up to it. Wesley Snipes is a good enough straight-forward meat and potatoes kick and punch guy, but his own fight scenes in these movies are too white-bread and unimaginative -- they often seems strangely lifeless and predictable. There's nothing about his style that's particularly interesting or especially athletic. Perhaps his choreographers were just working within his limitations.

So anyway, my choices are Iron Monkey, Chinese Connection, and Drunken Master. Those you can easily watch many, many times without tiring of either the movie or the moves.

I'm way behind on my Jet Li movies and Jackie Chan movies, and am sure there are plenty of other especially memorable ones.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
A comment about Blade -- the beginning of the first one was fantastic. But none of the martial arts moves or scenes Blade was personally involved with in the that movie or the next came close to matching up to it.

[/ QUOTE ] I thought so too. When that movie comes on, I'll watch the first 10 mins. and then change the channel quite frequently.

[ QUOTE ]
Wesley Snipes is a good enough straight-forward meat and potatoes kick and punch guy, but his own fight scenes in these movies are too white-bread and unimaginative -- they often seems strangely lifeless and predictable. There's nothing about his style that's particularly interesting or especially athletic. Perhaps his choreographers were just working within his limitations.


[/ QUOTE ]
That's actually what I like about them. I tend to prefer martial arts to be "meat and potatoes" to watching back flips or 30 min. scenes of two guys slapping each others arms while they play at doing Wing Chun poorly.

[dogsballs]

Iron Monkey - for the smack talking, esp the kid, and the super slick bit where the girl heroine sidekick type cuts the baddies throat with his own sword with her ankles by turning round. Good humour in it too; not trying to be a too serious film.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
Wesley Snipes is a good enough straight-forward meat and potatoes kick and punch guy, but his own fight scenes in these movies are too white-bread and unimaginative -- they often seems strangely lifeless and predictable. There's nothing about his style that's particularly interesting or especially athletic. Perhaps his choreographers were just working within his limitations.

That's actually what I like about them. I tend to prefer martial arts to be "meat and potatoes" to watching back flips or 30 min. scenes of two guys slapping each others arms while they play at doing Wing Chun poorly.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think I can see what you mean.

I can definitely get into the intensity of action that doesn't seem to be a prolonged dance, and then keeping things to a very few simple techniques can work okay.

But Blade's fight scenes can be extended sometimes too. When you wind up seeing the same reverse punch too many times, it gets kind of mind-numbing to me. It's no different than those endless kung fu blocking sequences, just narrowed way down to like two or three moves and put on a loop. I figure I can run and get a coke and come back and I won't have missed anything. After how good the first fight scene was, I'm surprised I wound up feeling that way about all the others.

The only other memorable fight scene in those two movies was the one in the second film where he fights those two ninja-type vampires who came to deliver him a message in the begginning of the film -- and that was because of the two ninjas and all their great moves, not Snipes.

I hope he doesn't just plod along and reverse-punch/sidekick his way through the third one. I think Blade is a series with a great formula, but it loses a lot if the fighting just becomes totally predictable.

Plus, no more making the climactic battle be one with a skinny metrosexual fruitcake, like the last one.

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
Plus, no more making the climactic battle be one with a skinny metrosexual fruitcake, like the last one.

[/ QUOTE ]
Not just the last one. The first one too. It was Stephen Dorff, all 119 lbs of him. I understand the whole metrosexual vampire thing, but the head vampire definitely needs to be tougher looking somehow.

[Blarg]

Haha, you're right, I forgot about Steven Dorff.

I still can't bring myself to see the new James Bond films, because whatever that guy's name is looks like my grandmother could bitch-slap him back and forth across the room while drinking a cup of cider and gumming a zweiback cookie.