3rd and 4th, HOw do I fix it.

[PapiChulo503]

Whats up guys\gals. I have been following the FAQ and im having a little problem. I find that by playing that tight im really shortstacked by the time I get down to 4 or 5 people. Last night I finished 4th 5 times and 3rd 3 times. Night before last I had similar results. Should I just keep on playing or is there something I should be adjusting? thnx for the help.

[tigerite]

It's not a bad thing to be short stacked, so long as you have folding equity. Just be careful that you don't drop much below 5-6bb if you can at all help it, even if this means pushing all-in with relative junk (see my J9o post). Playing in a game with Smiley last night (he won it, I got 2nd) I pushed all in over the top of UTG raiser and small stack in the BB (I was SB) with 89s when low stacked. You have to become a little 'crazy' in these situations because there simply isn't enough room to manoeuvre any other way. But also remember if you do get premium hands, or even decent midpairs, and get called on an all-in with 7-8BB, you'll mostly double up and from then on it becomes much more of a cruise.

[skirtus]

I had similiar results when following the guide. My results improved when I became more aggressive when 4-6 handed. Typically I am one of the smaller stacks when 6 handed but one of the larger stacks by the time we get to the bubble. Start looking for opportunities to steal blinds from the SB, Button, and even the CO when noone has limped in before you. Start posting some hands or hand histories of your shorthanded play.

[PapiChulo503]

what is meant by folding equity? I apologize if this qustion sounds stupid but im new to poker and dont have all of the terminology down.

[tigerite]

skirtus hit the nail on the head, really. Basically, the more chips you have, the less willing an opponent will be to call your all-in, because it hurts them. And, in fact, they are making a mistake in doing so, even if their advantage is 55 to 45 (and possibly 60 to 40, depending on chip counts etc). You have to pick your spots though - not a good idea to do this if a big stack is in the BB, or a small stack who is desperate, for instance.

[Sharksfan]

I've had the very same problem the last week..I started off doing very well with this method but all of that is gone now (the profit I made) and I'm taking a break from S&G's because of it. Every single game I'm either so short stacked by the time it gets to 4-5-6 players that I eventually go out when I go AI as I need to double up more than once to get back in the game. Or I do get myself back in the game, only to once again get nothing to play and get blinded back down to nothingness. There have been some bad beats along the way as well, but the main problem is not getting any hands to play. I definetly think the play needs to be loosened up if you haven't had a hand to play by a certain point, I guess figuring out when that point comes is the hard part, hehe. And obviously being short stacked IS a bad thing when you're always finishing 4th or 3rd.

[EnderW27]

Folding equity means having enough in your stack to make others consider folding.

Let's say blinds are at 100/200 and you have a stack of 300. You push all in UTG and it's folded around to me. I'm going to call you with any two cards. Any two. You have 0 folding equity.

Now, let's say you have a stack of 700 and you push UTG, folded around to me. Let's also say that now I'll only call you with the top 33% of hands possible. That means that 2/3 of the time, you'll get me to fold and pick up 300 badly needed chips. That's folding equity and it significantly helps with short stack survival.

[tigerite]

Actually with 1000 in the pot and only 500 to call, it's probably still correct to call with almost any two in this situation, unless it'll cripple your stack. That's why it's better to push with any two having 5-6 bb, these odds do not then exist.

[Paul2432]

[ QUOTE ]
Folding equity means having enough in your stack to make others consider folding.

Let's say blinds are at 100/200 and you have a stack of 300. You push all in UTG and it's folded around to me. I'm going to call you with any two cards. Any two. You have 0 folding equity.

Now, let's say you have a stack of 700 and you push UTG, folded around to me. Let's also say that now I'll only call you with the top 33% of hands possible. That means that 2/3 of the time, you'll get me to fold and pick up 300 badly needed chips. That's folding equity and it significantly helps with short stack survival.

[/ QUOTE ]

To be a little more precise:

folding equity = (size of pot) x (chance opponents will fold)

Paul

[Scuba Chuck]

Interesting solutions, and points to consider. It leaves me with a couple of basic questions from this neophyte.

EnderW27: What are the top 33% of hands?

Tigerite: I cannot find your J9o post. Can you direct me?

Thanks, Scuba

[Superfluous Man]

I suggest you stop folding pocket aces preflop to someone's all-in raise when it's 5-handed (also, when it's 2-handed, 3-handed, 4-handed, n-handed). Especially when you'll be fairly close to the average stack if you win with AA.

[tigerite]

I'm pretty sure he got disconnected, looking at the history he didn't play a hand til he got blinded off in 3rd from about midway through..