Speed Tourney = Oxymoron

[Sponger15SB]

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

I'm ITM and we've played like 10 hands in the last hour. This will be my first and last speed tourney ever.

Is there anyone here who actually plays this crap?

[Sponger15SB]

27 left and I've got 2,240 chips.

50,000/100,000 blinds and avg of 35,000.

I gotta go eat lunch with friends and get a haircut so I'm just leaving my computer, good strategy huh?

Seriously though I'm waiting for comment on how crap these tourneys are

[adanthar]

I play these all the time, stall properly, and have an over 100% ROI. Some of the speed regulars (people who only play speed tourneys, but always play them) have won a lot more than I have.

Yes, they get boring, but if you know your Gap Concept and some basic math theory you're miles ahead of the entire field (witness people that call all in in your situation with A9o, or those that refuse to stall as a medium stack with a large stack behind.)

If you play them properly you can kill them.

[TheTimeIsUp]

I agree. I think it takes a whole new strategy to play these, and even with a 1k+ field, they only last 2 hours.

[Sponger15SB]

hmmm. well I busted out in 18th, and when I left my house there were 27 people left.

I had 98o in the BB, SB had 95o. and there was a 5 on the river. Heartbreaking, but hey I didn't even know it until just now and looking over the hand histories.

[BlackAces]

These don't work at all given how bad Party is for slow play. The only one I played, we had one idiot who stalled every single time it was his turn to act. As a result, I think we played three hands total for two levels, and these were the crucial levels (300/600 and up).

I'll never be playing another one again. They're so bad that I "might as well play the f---ing lotto."

[ZootMurph]

I played once. It was too much for me to take. I emailed Party about a possible solution to the fact that the biggest strategy is not which hands you play, but how you manage the time. I personally feel this is a ridiculous way to play a $33 or $55 tournament. Never received a response.

[M.B.E.]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm ITM and we've played like 10 hands in the last hour.

[/ QUOTE ]
It is ironic, but not oxymoronic.

[MicroBob]

Good post adanthar.
I haven't played the party-speed tournies but have played a handful of the Stars-Turbos and the time-management issues are similar I suspect.

I think the quality of players in these things is generally worse so a good player should do better in the long-run.


Additionally, I think these more closely approximate many lower buy-in B&M tourneys (until you get closer to the bubble and have the whole stalling thing go on).
5-minute levels on the internet probably equal 20-minute levels at B&M I think.


But you are correct that you shouldn't play them if you have to be somewhere in a couple of hours because the stalling does NOT make them particularly fast.


I played an $11-turbo satellite on Stars where 25 or 30 or so qualified for the bigger prize ($215 tourney-dollars I think). The stalling began when there was 50 players left I think.
Since everybody gets the 15 seconds and then use the time-bank I think we averaged 1 hand for every 2 minutes or so and it was usually just someone stealing the blinds....or folded around to the blinds.

Anyway, with 5-minute levels....1 hand every 2 minutes = about 2 or 3 hands per level.
It was ust stupid.
I think it went up a couple of levels on me during one orbit one time. I was actually trying to hurry up the play so that I could pay a smaller blind when it got to me.

It was weird seeing that there was less tha 1 minute left at a given level....and hoping play would hurry up so that I could pay only 3k for the BB instead of 4k (or something like that).

the timing and everything gets really tricky on those things (at least on stars it does) but I'm convinced that a little experience, analysis and smarts can give one a significant advantage in the long-run.
I just haven't gotten around to figuring out exactly how to obtain that advantage yet.

but, to repeat, the levels are the ONLY thing that are speedy about these tournaments.
All they would have to do is start hand-for-hand sooner and...voila....problem solved.

[adanthar]

[ QUOTE ]
the timing and everything gets really tricky on those things (at least on stars it does) but I'm convinced that a little experience, analysis and smarts can give one a significant advantage in the long-run.
I just haven't gotten around to figuring out exactly how to obtain that advantage yet.

[/ QUOTE ]

Two tips:
-It is NOT always advantageous for a big stack on the button to autocall a tiny stack in the blinds. Usually, you'd think a 'free' shot at knocking someone out would be good, but there are two exceptions to this rule. Figure them out and figure out why they are exceptions and you'll be halfway there.
-Once you have realized what the exceptions are (another hint: one has to do with position, the other with stack size), try to figure out the implications.

I'm being deliberately obtuse because these are so soft and so plentiful that I really don't want this to get too widespread. There's a reason people like dcrazzed, worldwide58 and tuggnut are in every single one of these.

[DVC Calif]

[ QUOTE ]
Two tips:
-It is NOT always advantageous for a big stack on the button to autocall a tiny stack in the blinds. Usually, you'd think a 'free' shot at knocking someone out would be good, but there are two exceptions to this rule. Figure them out and figure out why they are exceptions and you'll be halfway there.
-Once you have realized what the exceptions are (another hint: one has to do with position, the other with stack size), try to figure out the implications.

I'm being deliberately obtuse because these are so soft and so plentiful that I really don't want this to get too widespread. There's a reason people like dcrazzed, worldwide58 and tuggnut are in every single one of these.

[/ QUOTE ]

Reason No. 1 - You don't want to bust out the smaller stack in front of you (or behind you) because that empty chair might be filled by a stacker bigger than yours when the other tables breakup. Surviving the blinds is more important than building stack in the late stages of this tourney.

Reason No. 2 - The most important concept is that you are really playing against the other tables, rather than the other players at your table. If you have a low table number, everyone at the table can help each other out by surviving as a unit. There's no problem losing a hand to another player who's stack is smaller than yours. Let T110 double up at your expense. As long at T85,000 doesn't pop onto your table into that empty seat.

And the stalling is not so much about letting the blinds get bigger to bust out smaller stacks. It's more about waiting out the other tables so they lose players faster, advancing your own position.

Steve

[M.B.E.]

[ QUOTE ]
If you have a low table number, everyone at the table can help each other out by surviving as a unit.

[/ QUOTE ]
Incidentally this is a huge flaw in the way Party MTTs operate. Which table breaks next ought to be unpredictable.