Rate My Bad Play [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

Grisgra

11-22-2004, 10:30 PM

Hand #1: Good fold? Should I have played it differently? Very loose/passive table as I recall.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: "Hero" is SB with T/images/graemlins/heart.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
1 fold, MP calls, 1 fold, Button calls, "Hero" completes, BB checks.

Flop: (4 SB) 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 7/images/graemlins/club.gif, 3/images/graemlins/club.gif (4 players)
"Hero" checks, BB bets, MP calls, Button calls, "Hero" calls.

Turn: (4 BB) A/images/graemlins/club.gif (4 players)
"Hero" checks, BB bets, MP folds, Button raises, "Hero" folds, BB folds.

Final Pot: 7 BB
Main Pot: 6 BB, won by Button.
Pot 2: 1 BB, returned to Button.

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Hand #2: If you Don't Bet, They Can't Fold.

I like this one, so I'm posting it. And you can't stop me.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: "Hero" is BB with 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
1 fold, MP calls, CO raises, 1 fold, SB calls, "Hero" calls, MP calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 5/images/graemlins/club.gif, 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 players)
SB checks, "Hero" bets, MP calls, CO calls, SB calls.

Turn: (6 BB) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 players)
SB checks, "Hero" bets, MP calls, CO calls, SB calls.

River: (10 BB) 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (4 players)
SB checks, "Hero" bets, MP folds, CO folds, SB folds.

Final Pot: 11 BB
Main Pot: 10 BB, won by "Hero".
Pot 2: 1 BB, returned to "Hero".

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Hand #3: Is the pf coldcall here terrible? Obviously the play the rest of the hand is completely atrocious, but I'm wondering about preflop.

Re postflop . . . I just *believed* him. Shees.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: "Hero" is SB with K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG calls, MP calls, 1 fold, Button raises, "Hero" calls, BB calls, UTG calls, MP calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/club.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif (5 players)
"Hero" checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Button bets, "Hero" calls, BB folds, UTG calls, MP folds.

Turn: (6.50 BB) K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (3 players)
"Hero" checks, UTG checks, Button bets, "Hero" calls, UTG folds.

River: (8.50 BB) 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players)
"Hero" checks, Button checks.

Final Pot: 8.50 BB
Main Pot: 8.50 BB, between Button and "Hero".
------------------
Hand #4: Standard?

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: "Hero" is BB with 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
2 folds, CO calls, 2 folds, "Hero" checks.

Flop: (2.40 SB) 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
"Hero" bets, CO raises, "Hero" 3-bets, CO calls.

Turn: (4.20 BB) 5/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
"Hero" bets, CO calls.

River: (6.20 BB) J/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
"Hero" checks, CO checks.

Final Pot: 6.20 BB
Main Pot: 6.20 BB, between CO and "Hero".

imitation

11-22-2004, 10:47 PM

Hand 1: fold on the flop, reverse domination sucks, 2 to the flush with 3 callers sucks.

Hand 2: hmmm so maths people this only has to work 1 in 10 for it to be correct right? Even if it's -EV gee your table image would get a boost if you got called...

Hand 3: I wouldn't preflop with so many in, but say the cat clicked and I found myself on the flop i'd fold.

Hand 4: Lead the flop, call the raise, fold the turn. Don't start a fight over 2.4SB with middle pair-crap kicker.

Jeff W

11-23-2004, 01:26 AM

1: You don't have odds to call on the flop. You're drawing to a hand which your opponents can easily overtake and which may be dominated when you hit it.

2: Although you took the pot down on the river, do you believe you'll win this 1/11 times against 3 opponents?

3: Pre flop and flop are okay, but the turn/river are ugly. Bet or check/raise the turn and more importantly, bet the river if he doesn't raise/3-bet the turn. The flush card protects you from a raise and you don't want the river checked through.

4: If you're going to 3-bet the flop if he raises, then you should check/raise instead because it costs you less to assert your authority in the hand. Try this thread: Check/Raising from the Blinds (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=mediumholdem&Number=856865 &fpart=&PHPSESSID=) . The advice in that thread mainly applies to situations where you call a raise pre flop from the blinds and having a smaller pot changes the dynamic, but it still applies to situations where your opponents are overaggressive with position.

Guido

11-23-2004, 04:29 AM

Hand 1: I raise preflop but that's just me. I fold on the flop.

Hand 2: I wouldn't bet the river against 3 opponents but maybe I'm just weak /images/graemlins/grin.gif.

Hand 3: I bet or check-raise the turn depending on the aggression factor of the bettor.

Hand 4: I check-raise the flop and fold to any more aggression.

Guido

Grisgra

11-23-2004, 12:11 PM

[ QUOTE ]
1: You don't have odds to call on the flop. You're drawing to a hand which your opponents can easily overtake and which may be dominated when you hit it.

2: Although you took the pot down on the river, do you believe you'll win this 1/11 times against 3 opponents?

3: Pre flop and flop are okay, but the turn/river are ugly. Bet or check/raise the turn and more importantly, bet the river if he doesn't raise/3-bet the turn. The flush card protects you from a raise and you don't want the river checked through.

4: If you're going to 3-bet the flop if he raises, then you should check/raise instead because it costs you less to assert your authority in the hand. Try this thread: Check/Raising from the Blinds (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=mediumholdem&Number=856865 &fpart=&PHPSESSID=) . The advice in that thread mainly applies to situations where you call a raise pre flop from the blinds and having a smaller pot changes the dynamic, but it still applies to situations where your opponents are overaggressive with position.

[/ QUOTE ]

#1: I agree.
#2: Against *these* three opponents, maybe. Pretty loose-passive-calling station table. I noticed a couple other times that people were calling to the river with god-knows-what and then folding en masse. The fact that there were so many people in made me think that a naked ace is going to call this bet less often, and IMO there was less than a 90% chance that someone had a pocket or a king. And that 2 sure didn't help anyone. (Pretty sure I would have heard from a king on the turn.)

And lord knows I'm not winning a showdown /images/graemlins/smile.gif.

#3: So okay pf? I agree that I completely wussed out on the flop/turn.

#4: I agree in principle -- if I know he'll auto-bet the flop when checked to then a checkraise might be best. But I wasn't sure he'd be overaggressive with position, so why not just try to win it on the flop? If I check and he checks, then he gets a free card for nothin'.

djoyce003

11-23-2004, 12:55 PM

hand 1 - i'd probably fold the flop, you have nothing and are likely reversed dominated, if an ace falls, it could be the club (which it was) and it might not even be a winner for you if it isn't a club.

hand 2 - risky but it worked, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, I think 1 in 10 is worth a shot though.

hand 3 - Am I the only one who re-raises a button raise here? I play 1/2 so maybe it's not the same at the 5/10, but a LOT of people raise the button at 1/2 with Ax, or even K10, KJ, all of which you are a pretty good shot to beat, especially if you can fold/punish some of the limpers. I would call the flop, RAISE the turn and bet the river.

Hand 4 - I might fold to the raise unless my read on my opponent was that he'd bluff a lot, then i'd 3bet like you did. Really read dependent so I cop out on this one.

PokerNoob

11-23-2004, 02:22 PM

Hand #1 I would raise preflop and lead the flop.

Hand #2 is iffy at best preflop. After that, I like it because you keep picking up outs and your ace outcard could be action generating. The river bet is a must, its the only way to win the pot and you can fold if raised. Obviously a K or a mid pocket will try to get a raise in on the turn, so everybody is looking for a reason to fold the river and you gave it to them.

Hand #3 depends on button's raising standards. I'd checkraise the turn. Button may go "aww crap, this guy coldcalled KJ" and just call down with a winning hand. Plus I kinda want to see what UTG is up to.

Hand #4 looks good to me depending on your read of CO's open limp.

Grisgra

11-30-2004, 02:19 PM

Hand #3, he had AQ, I believe.
Hand #4, CO was going nutty on the flop with A4o.