Another rap poll - best freestyler

[ilya]

[bonanz]

black thought?

mad skillz?

[Topflight]

Eyedea

[Reef]

didn't Em win those underground rap "olympics" many times over?

[bonanz]

oh, jin

[Sponger15SB]

[ QUOTE ]
didn't Em win those underground rap "olympics" many times over?

[/ QUOTE ]

also, didn't jayz put up $1,000,000 to battle against somebody. i hear he has some good skills.

[ThaSaltCracka]

seeing how two of the people on your poll are dead, I am not surprised other has the most votes. Keep in mind people, Biggie and Jay-Z are two artists that rap/rapped nearly all their studio album songs off the top of their head. Yup, no rhyme books for either of them.

[Piz0wn0reD!!!!!!]

what a poor list of rappers.

[Malone Brown]

Eyedea....by far. Those who have never heard him freestyle are missing something huge.
Malone

[Beerfund]

[ QUOTE ]
oh, jin

[/ QUOTE ]

was this a joke? that guy is garbage and mad skillz is even worse. Em and canibus are good but the best ever was biggie

[Malone Brown]

Supernatural would also be way up on my list.
Malone

[Malone Brown]

Download Eyedea's Blaze Battle freestyle vs. R.K. and no one will have a doubt that he is the best freestyler (also a freestlye against another Rhymesayer, Brother Ali).
Malone

[nothumb]

First, Eminem won the Rap Olympics once. He is nice.

Second, the fact that people on the poll are dead does not take them out of the running for best freestyler ever.

In fact, having Big L on this poll makes it completely fine, because he is the best, ever, period. Biggie is the best rapper and Big L is the best freestyler. All of you who say otherwise are dead wrong. You are probably the same type of rap fans who think Aesop Rock is better than Biggie, or Atmosphere is better than Tupac.

NT

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
what a poor list of rappers.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fair enough, I'm sure there are thousands of people out there who know more about the freestyle scene than I do.
What would your list be?

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
Eyedea....by far. Those who have never heard him freestyle are missing something huge.
Malone

[/ QUOTE ]

He is g00t

[bonanz]

[ QUOTE ]
was this a joke? that guy is garbage and mad skillz is even worse. Em and canibus are good but the best ever was biggie

[/ QUOTE ]

this thread wasn't best rapper or lyricist. it was best freestyler. people's definitions of freestyle vary, but to me it is cracking the wit whip, mainly off the top of the head. not just spitting some written [censored] over some other beat.

Biggie is the greatest (please see avatar) but i do not believe he was that terrific of a freestyler by the definition listed above.

yes i said wit whip

[MCS]

[ QUOTE ]
You are probably the same type of rap fans who think Aesop Rock is better than Biggie, or Atmosphere is better than Tupac.


[/ QUOTE ]

LOL, that was funny.

I like Big L better than Biggie. Big L's my all-time favorite. I agree that Eyedea is nice; I saw him in Atlanta with Living Legends.

People don't understand how hard freestyling really is when you don't cheat.

Oh, also, Juice and Supernatural are both sick.

[ThaSaltCracka]

Big L is tight, but better than Biggie /images/graemlins/confused.gif

Big L could have blown up if he wasn't murdered, that CD was just dec, really didn't showcase his skills completely.

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
In fact, having Big L on this poll makes it completely fine, because he is the best, ever, period. Biggie is the best rapper and Big L is the best freestyler. All of you who say otherwise are dead wrong. You are probably the same type of rap fans who think Aesop Rock is better than Biggie, or Atmosphere is better than Tupac.

NT

[/ QUOTE ]

This is puzzling because I think Big L is the best of the 4 I named, but I also think Aesop Rock is a better rapper than Biggie. Well not exactly, since it's a bit like comparing apples and oranges...but still. Biggie obviously has more charm and a smoother flow, and he doesn't tend to lapse into nonsense. But he doesn't have as much range as Aesop in terms of the characters he presents, and his language is just nowhere near as complex. Yeah complexity is not a virtue in and of itself, and a lot of times Aesop gets carried away, but the best of his metaphors and images are better than anything Biggie ever rapped. I'd also say that while Biggie is awesome at saying absolutely nothing in a compelling way, Aesop is somewhat aware of the world outside rap and has something to say about it.

[bonanz]

[ QUOTE ]
but I also think Aesop Rock is a better rapper than Biggie.

[/ QUOTE ]

BLASPHEMER!

[ThaSaltCracka]

[ QUOTE ]
I'd also say that while Biggie is awesome at saying absolutely nothing in a compelling way, Aesop is somewhat aware of the world outside rap and has something to say about it.

[/ QUOTE ] Biggies world was Bed Stuy in Brooklyn and Manhattan. What more would you want a high school drop out drug dealer to talk about? He spoke so truthfully about his life, and that is something we may not see in hip hop for a long time.

[ThaSaltCracka]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
but I also think Aesop Rock is a better rapper than Biggie.

[/ QUOTE ]

BLASPHEMER!

[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah I agree, I dl some Aesop, and I ain't feelin it at all.

[bonanz]

the rapper who is best at saying nothing in a compelling way is ludacris. I mean really i never hear him rap about anything at all.

"get back"
"stand up"
"get back"
"move bitch"

I enjoy luda's music for the most part, but it's just a running joke between me and a few friends that luda's songs are never about anything.

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'd also say that while Biggie is awesome at saying absolutely nothing in a compelling way, Aesop is somewhat aware of the world outside rap and has something to say about it.

[/ QUOTE ] Biggies world was Bed Stuy in Brooklyn and Manhattan. What more would you want a high school drop out drug dealer to talk about? He spoke so truthfully about his life, and that is something we may not see in hip hop for a long time.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have no problem with that, it's just that there's only so much to say about that life.

[ThaSaltCracka]

true, maybe its good he only had two CD's, although I don't know if his style would have changed for the good or bad if he had made more.

[ThaSaltCracka]

Luda may very well be the best rhymer out right now.
I think Ghostface has the best flow right now, and Nas has the best lyrics right now.

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
but I also think Aesop Rock is a better rapper than Biggie.

[/ QUOTE ]

BLASPHEMER!

[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah I agree, I dl some Aesop, and I ain't feelin it at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

Aesop's very much an acquired taste, give an album of his a few listens, you might change your mind. Or you can just listen to Biggie, he's good too. Whatever floats your boat man.

[ThaSaltCracka]

let me put it this way, Aesop could be worse. He falls into the "weird" group of underground artists. I sort of wish he could polish his style.

[J_V]

I agree, freestyling better be off the top of your head. I don't know these other guys, but Jin was very good.

[Q8offsuit]

How little Marshall Mathers could be considered the best of anything is beyond me.

[ThaSaltCracka]

[ QUOTE ]
How little Marshall Mathers could be considered the best of anything is beyond me.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't get you man. Whats wrong with Marshall?

[Malone Brown]

[ QUOTE ]
but I also think Aesop Rock is a better rapper than Biggie.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with this completely. As is Sage Francis.

[Robk]

the correct answer is juice.

hon. mention: em, supernatural.

[glen]

has anyone heard the eminem/dilated peoples freestyle. . . that rules: "Spectacular, battle rap manufacturer, stole ya mom's acura, wrecked it and sold it back to her. . . . "

[dr. klopek]

Sage Francis, Mikah 9, Apathy, Lateef, my homeboy Tom, Styles of Beyond, Del, Tash, Gift of Gab, Lyrics Born, Adeem, and a bunch of other folks I've seen and heard over the years.

[dr. klopek]

I couldn't possibly comment on everything in this thread that warrants one, so instead, these are the pages of some folks that I think you should all check out if you haven't heard of them. Enjoy.

http://www.projectblowed.com/
http://www.quannum.com/home.html
http://www.non-prophets.com/home/
http://www.peopleunderthestairs.net

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
How little Marshall Mathers could be considered the best of anything is beyond me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, have you heard him battle? He's half-decent.

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
has anyone heard the eminem/dilated peoples freestyle. . . that rules: "Spectacular, battle rap manufacturer, stole ya mom's acura, wrecked it and sold it back to her. . . . "

[/ QUOTE ]

That's one of his best

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
Sage Francis, Mikah 9, Apathy, Lateef, my homeboy Tom, Styles of Beyond, Del, Tash, Gift of Gab, Lyrics Born, Adeem, and a bunch of other folks I've seen and heard over the years.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow, Ryu and Tak freestyle? I didn't know that

[vulturesrow]

Why wasnt Vanilla Ice one of the choices. Clearly the best in all facets of rap music.

[MCS]

[ QUOTE ]
How little Marshall Mathers could be considered the best of anything is beyond me.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's not beyond most rappers. Most of them think he's excellent. If you want specifics, his breath control and diction are the best out there.

SaltCracka, I was not making a statement as to who is "better" between Biggie and L. They were both great. I just happen to like L more.

[ThaSaltCracka]

[ QUOTE ]
SaltCracka, I was not making a statement as to who is "better" between Biggie and L. They were both great. I just happen to like L more.

[/ QUOTE ] Yeah L is tight, but, like I said, its too bad he never really was able to put out one real studio album. "ebonics" is an awesome song, but "Flamboyant" is my personal favorite.

[Rob Blackburn]

This poll shoud lbe named who is the best commercial freestyler.

Saying Big L is the best ever period is insane.

Biggie and Aesop are two diff. styles how can you even compare them.

Why does everyone cream so much over Biggie? If it weren't for his production and engineering on those albums he would be nothing. I contend you could have put anyone from NYC with halfway decent skills and those beats and its triple plat.

Anyway there are tons of real freestyle MCs that are better than all of those guys on that list, if I have to pick one its SUPERNAT. Honorable mention: Top Ramen, Illmaculate, Mac Lethal, and ADM

[ThaSaltCracka]

[ QUOTE ]
Why does everyone cream so much over Biggie? If it weren't for his production and engineering on those albums he would be nothing. I contend you could have put anyone from NYC with halfway decent skills and those beats and its triple plat.

[/ QUOTE ] absurd.

[turnipmonster]

[ QUOTE ]
Biggie and Jay-Z are two artists that rap/rapped nearly all their studio album songs off the top of their head. Yup, no rhyme books for either of them.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't buy it at all. are there tapes of these guys freestyling live?

--turnipmonster

[ThaSaltCracka]

I don't care if you buy it or not, I have read and seen dozens of interviews with various hip hop artist that have worked with either of them and they all say the same thing. Biggie did everything off the top of his head. I don't know if he "wrote" them before in his mind or what, but he never wrote any of his [censored] down, either does Jay-Z. Jay-Z does the same exact thing that Big did, no surprise the Biggie was Jay-Z's early mentor of sorts. You know that Jay-Z wrote a lot of Dre's lyrics for 2001, right?

[turnipmonster]

there's a big difference between doing something you memorized and improvising something like that in real time. not to mention all that stuff on commercial cds is ripped apart and put back together in pro tools. that's why I'd love to hear a live tape.

--turnipmonster

[ThaSaltCracka]

When you say memorized, you make it sound like he wrote it down and then memorized it. Again, let me stress, he(BIG) never wrote anything down. I think some people musically speaking have a gift, Biggie was one of those people. Its sort of like Jazz musicians from the 50's man, they would go into the studio and basically jam, do it all off the top of their head, but thats because they could hear it/picture it in their mind before it even came out. I think Big(especially on the first CD) was like that. The beats and production on Ready to Die don't make that CD a classic, its Biggies lyrics and overall mic presence. I mean he truely carries the listener along with him on a voyage through his world. Unbelievable stuff man.

[WEASEL45]

Royce da 5'9 wrote most of dre's lyrics on 2001

[ThaSaltCracka]

naw man, S. Carter, look at the credits.

[WEASEL45]

listen to Royce's cd

[turnipmonster]

the reason I am interested in this is because I am a professional jazz musician, so I know a lot about what goes into improvising. it's not just a magical gift from above. one of the greatest jazz improvisors of all time, charlie parker, practiced 12-18 hours a day from the time he was 15 until he was in his 20's. he was very obsessive about it.

I would like to check out that cd however.

--turnipmonster

[dr. klopek]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sage Francis, Mikah 9, Apathy, Lateef, my homeboy Tom, Styles of Beyond, Del, Tash, Gift of Gab, Lyrics Born, Adeem, and a bunch of other folks I've seen and heard over the years.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow, Ryu and Tak freestyle? I didn't know that

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, quite well actually. They are two of the best freestylers I've ever seen. I went to a show here in Portland where there were like 7 people, so they were just havin some fun with it, and they freestyled over the whole "Winnetka Exit" beat, it was amazing. Why is it that every decent conversation about hip-hop has to deteriorate into a B.I.G vs someone argument? Jay-Z is a good freestyler, I can say that having seen him, what you think are Big L freestyles are written, Supernatural is gimmicky, and it doesn't matter, because the people in my above post with a list of names are the best. Check out the links. Treat yourself.

[dr. klopek]

[ QUOTE ]
the reason I am interested in this is because I am a professional jazz musician, so I know a lot about what goes into improvising. it's not just a magical gift from above. one of the greatest jazz improvisors of all time, charlie parker, practiced 12-18 hours a day from the time he was 15 until he was in his 20's. he was very obsessive about it.

I would like to check out that cd however.

--turnipmonster

[/ QUOTE ]

Man, you should check out "Timetable" by Mikah 9. He's one of the jazziest cats rappin. This album has a scat song on it. He is what a rapper should be: content, rhythm, melody, breath control, delivery, etc. I listen to a fair amount of jazz myself, my love of jazz has influenced what I think music should (could) be like, and Mikah 9 far from disappoints me.

[turnipmonster]

thanks for the heads up! I will definitely check that out.

--turnipmonster

[ThaSaltCracka]

I may have stated wrong. I know for a fact Jay-Z wrote some of the lyrics on Dre's CD, but its possible Royce wrote some as well. Look at the credits for "Still DRE".

[ThaSaltCracka]

you are right, and I can't believe the way I said it made it seem like it was a gift. But I do think some people are naturally more inclined to be gifted at music/art than others. As for the work put into the music, artist like Biggie, Jay-z, Nas, Redman, Wu-Tang, Busta all developed their skills first and foremost by battle rapping and freestyling with friends. Rap changed some time in the late 90's to what it is now where everything is about style, production, and image. Rappers in the ealr days had to work at their skill, so its not surprising that some of the best pure lyricist are from that era. Biggie was no different then them. I have seen some crazy videos of him freestyling in Brooklyn on the street, and the strange thing is, he sounds the exact same. Look at the rappers who put on a good live show, you know the ones you can understand and hear clearly, thats skill man, thats practice. Biggie was that.

[MCS]

[ QUOTE ]
Look at the rappers who put on a good live show, you know the ones you can understand and hear clearly, thats skill man, thats practice. Biggie was that.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is also one of the ways people should be able to recognize that Eminem is dope.

[ThaSaltCracka]

I agree, i saw him live and he was very good. But I think Dre has helped him a lot in that regard. I have just seen video and heard audio of Biggie, but he always sounded clear.