AJo and KQo

[FoodForThought]

Is it correct to call in early position with AJo and KQo in a typical Party $3/$6 game?

[Bodhi]

Textbook recommendation is fold in a tight game (3-5 players see the flop on average), call in a loose game (6-8 players see the flop on average).

[thirddan]

No, you should raise them...I will raise them in any position except the blinds when there are a lot of limpers, but make it AQ and it turns into any position...

[FoodForThought]

Which textbook? I'd much rather play AJo against 1 or 2 players....versus 7 or 8.

[chesspain]

This question must get asked once per month. The prevailing opinion of most good players is that for KQo, and maybe even for AJo, there doesn't appear to be much difference in long-term EV between calling, folding or raising from EP.

[Chris Daddy Cool]

i'd raise with both, espeically if i'm the first one in.

but the real point to me responding to this post is that the new Eminem CD, Encore, is pretty good, but not as good as Eminem Show. There are a couple of tracks that are just hilarious.

"Peace out to all the shorties."
- Bisonbison

[colgin]

[ QUOTE ]
The prevailing opinion of most good players is that for KQo, and maybe even for AJo, there doesn't appear to be much difference in long-term EV between calling, folding or raising from EP.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is that really the prevailing opinion? I would agree that there is not that much difference between raising and calling from EP with KQo and AJo in a typical $3/6 game. I thought that was the prevailing opinion. I think folding is significantly worse but I am willing to be convinced otherwise.

[Bodhi]

Small Stakes Hold'Em by Ed Miller

[Rubeskies]

[ QUOTE ]
Small Stakes Hold'Em by Ed Miller

[/ QUOTE ]

Miller specifically mentions AJo and KQo as hands you can play in early position in the 3-5 player game. He doesn't say to raise them, but he sure as hell doesn't say to fold them.

[IndieMatty]

What he said, with a dash of ATo.

[Bodhi]

my memory must be bad then! /images/graemlins/blush.gif

[Rubeskies]

He actually also says to raise AJo and KQo in the loose 6-8 player games. You might want to reread your book there.

[bernie]

I don't know about the party 3-6 game, but i raise these in EP. I can't remember the last time of folded either of them in EP.

I believe these 2 hands are responsible for alot of action i get on passive tables when i raise in EP. It 'looks' like a loose raise to them. I joke around with one gal in my regular game about KQo. Everytime i raise in EP, she cackles and says, 'KQo!?!' I laugh and say, 'of course.' Sometimes she'll look at me and i'll remind her by saying 'KQo' very plainly to her. Slowly i'll smile. Then she snickers for about a hand or 2. Now if I even mention KQo to her as I'm passing by she giggles a bit and shakes her head. This is also her reaction after she sucks out on a hand with a crap holding, ill mention, 'Well, it's not KQo, but it'll do.'

b

[bdk3clash]

I know I've said this before, but...

I made a deal with my opponents. I'll keep raising AJo, KQo, and KJs in EP as long as they'll keep calling with worse hands and missing bets when they're ahead. So far, they're keeping up their end of the deal.

[Sarge85]

[ QUOTE ]
I know I've said this before, but...

I made a deal with my opponents. I'll keep raising AJo, KQo, and KJs in EP as long as they'll keep calling with worse hands and missing bets when they're ahead. So far, they're keeping up their end of the deal.

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL you kill me.

Sarge/images/graemlins/diamond.gif

[sthief09]

A New Innovation! (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/search.php?Cat=)


you are asking some pretty basic questions for someone who has already said he's going to take all my money and that I'm a "chump"

[sfer]

shaddup u fish...lol!!!1...i will skewl you @ pokr!!!11...hahahaha.

[sthief09]

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


OMFG UNREAL

[helpmeout]

Exactly not to mention that you'll get a lot of players folding slightly better hands for fear of domination.

You limp in with AJo the guy with AQo would probably raise.

You raise AJo and the guy with AQo is more likely to fold.

[Malcom Reynolds]

Here's a good reason for asking "basic questions": in SSHE Ed suggests in EP to RAISE AJo and KQo in loose games (6-8 to the flop) and just call AJo and KQo in tight games (3-5 to the flop). Meanwhile the general advice here is to raise these in EP.

So I figure people will keep on asking this question in this forum so long as it remains in print...

[sthief09]

if anyone else asked the question I would've given it a real answer. the fact that he's done is best to try and insult every person that posts here doesn't exactly make me want to help him.

anyway, AJo and KQo is so close, that it doesn't really matter. I feel like Ed putting them as a limp in tighter games is almost arbitrary, but the reason why you should raise in looser games is because your preflop equity is greater. in tight games when you're getting cold called by hands like AT+ and KQ+, there isn't as much value in raising these hands preflop

[Evan]

Josh's post was in reference to this (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=smallholdem&Number=1243612 &page=1&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=14&fpart=all) thread

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
You raise AJo and the guy with AQo is more likely to fold

[/ QUOTE ]

I really don't see too many players folding AQo to a raise. From my experience, im about the only 1 i see doing it. If the guy has some knowledge, he'd likely 3 bet, if he doesn't, he'd just coldcall. He'd coldcall even if it was an absolute rock raising.

I mean, it's a nice thought, but kind of unrealistic. Unless you're on a tighter, tougher table.

b

[thirddan]

i fold AQo to a raise most of the time, AQs occasionally also...

[Malcom Reynolds]

Wow.

I just read that entire thread and now I feel dumber after reading it.

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
i fold AQo to a raise most of the time, AQs occasionally also...

[/ QUOTE ]

I was talking about the average player, not the average poster on 2 + 2.

The posters know it's also player/positionally dependant.

b

[thirddan]

you said you do it and i didn't want you to feel lonely /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[bernie]

_

[helpmeout]

There are a lot of tight players playing $3/$6 who would fold AQo to a raise.

It also doesnt need to happen much for it to be profitable.